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Author Topic: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE  (Read 61847 times)

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Offline AMG Coordinator

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AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« on: October 26, 2007, 06:44:01 PM »
Hello Everyone,

It's that time of year.  Time to vote for next years AMG destination!  I'm interested in everyone's TOP 2 choices.  I urge anyone who may have an interest in attending next year to please cast your vote. 

Although you are free to vote for any destination, please keep in mind that a large urban setting, preferably with an international airport close by, works best to suit the needs of our group.

In order to committ to a destination by years end, please cast all votes by November 17th.

Please also visit http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=16696.0 to vote for which month next year's AMG should be held.

Thanks!
Dennis

Offline pozniceguy

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2007, 07:21:10 PM »
1.  Dallas , Texas...  USA ....  center of the US... major international airport..many local attractions...average to low  cost ..lower than most large cities...friendly community

2. Houston , Texas...... easy to get to..  large city ..many attractions...   friendly community...large International Airport...
remember the good times...honor the past but don't live there
Le stelle la notte sono grandie luminose, nel cuore profondo del Texas

Dan J.

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2007, 07:41:09 PM »
 1.Provincetown, Mass http://www.ptown.org/
 2. Portland Oregon http://www.portland.com/portland/index.cfm?objectid=5E893295-C09F-22F2-195F99FCBB7A8DC3

Provincetown was named one of the top 10 gay friendly cities in the U.S.
Portland for it's mild climate.

Location doesn't really matter, but since I had to choose 2 places those are the ones I chose.

« Last Edit: October 26, 2007, 07:53:11 PM by Dan J. »

Offline allanq

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2007, 08:43:25 PM »
I'd like to suggest that we do the voting in two stages.

Step 1: Everyone votes for two cities.

Step 2: Select the top three or four cities from the first step. Then everyone votes for one of the top 3 or 4.

The purpose of the two-step process is to avoid selecting a location that only a small minority wants. In the most extreme case, say fifty people each vote for two cities and 99 cities are named. The city receiving two votes would win. I realize that this particular scenario is unlikely to happen, but it shows how we could wind up with a city that very few people really want.

I also hope that we will be allowed to change our votes up until the deadline.

What do others think?

Allan
« Last Edit: October 26, 2007, 10:56:14 PM by allanq »
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Offline RapidRod

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #4 on: October 26, 2007, 09:33:58 PM »
1. Dallas
2. Anywhere USA.
3. I don't really care. I'll just try my best to make it. I just don't have funds to go overseas.

Offline RICKY77531

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2007, 09:55:08 PM »
1.Houston

2.Dallas

3.why?????????........ everythings bigger in Texas......  :o
06/2007   CD4 266  Vl 62000
06/2007   CD4 200  Vl 13495
07/2007   ATRIPLA
09/2007   CD4 323  VL Undetectable
11/2007   CD4 428  VL Undetectable
01/2008   CD4 357  VL Undetectable
04/2008   CD4 357  VL UNDETECTABLE
08/2008   CD4 402  VL UNDETECTABLE
11/2008   CD4 421  79 DETECTABLE..
2/2009     CD4 450  VL UNDETECTABLE

Offline MOONLIGHT1114

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #6 on: October 26, 2007, 09:59:06 PM »
1)  Boston - or somewhere in New England, cause it just gets too damn hot in Sept.

2) Baltimore/DC area  "East Coast"   :D
HIV+ since '93, 1/12 - CD4 785 and undet.   WOO-HOO!!

Online Dachshund

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2007, 10:09:37 PM »
1. Amsterdam

2. London

Offline emeraldize

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2007, 10:16:58 PM »
Excellent choices!

1. Amsterdam ( this would be an outstanding location for AMG '08)

2. London

Offline Robert

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #9 on: October 27, 2007, 12:24:55 AM »
1.  Amsterdam
2.  Amsterdam

And I agree wholly with Allanq's suggestion.  Makes sense to me.

robert
..........

Offline komnaes

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #10 on: October 27, 2007, 02:25:31 PM »
First choice, London

Second choice, if it has to be in the US, Seattle (I wish I could say San Francisco, but I missed this year's AMG..)
Aug 07 Diagnosed
Oct 07 CD4=446(19%) Feb 08 CD4=421(19%)
Jun 08 CD4=325(22%) Jul 08 CD4=301(18%)
Sep 08 CD4=257/VL=75,000 Oct 08 CD4=347(16%)
Dec 08 CD4=270(16%)
Jan 09 CD4=246(13%)/VL=10,000
Feb 09 CD4=233(15%)/VL=13,000
Started meds Sustiva/Epzicom
May 09 CD4=333(24%)/VL=650
Aug 09 CD4=346(24%)/VL=UD
Nov 09 CD4=437(26%)/VL=UD
Feb 10 CD4=471(31%)/VL=UD
June 10 CD4=517 (28%)/VL=UD
Sept 10 CD4=687 (31%)/VL=UD
Jan 11 CD4=557 (30%)/VL=UD
April 11 CD4=569 (32%)/VL=UD
Switched to Epizcom, Reyataz and Norvir
(Interrupted for 2 months with only Epizcom & Reyataz)
July 11 CD=520 (28%)/VL=UD
Oct 11 CD=771 (31%)/VL=UD(<30)
April 12 CD=609 (28%)/VL=UD(<20)
Aug 12 CD=657 (29%)/VL=UD(<20)
Dec 12 CD=532 (31%)/VL=UD(<20)
May 13 CD=567 (31%)/VL=UD(<20)
Jan 14 CD=521 (21%)/VL=UD(<50)

Offline englishgirl

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2007, 03:16:03 PM »
my choices are anywhere in mexico and anywhere in canada. why? because it remains ILLEGAL for poz people to enter the US on a regular visa.

note that despite the fact i live in europe i have respected the fact that most of the americans said they couldnt afford to get to europe and have therefore voted for parts of your continent rather than mine, despite the fact that it makes it hugely expensive for me to attend amg. i would appreciate it if you would return the courtesy by not voting for somewhere that i would have to commit a FELONY to get to.

oh, and i think allan's suggestion is good too
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Offline Ann

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #12 on: October 27, 2007, 03:53:09 PM »
1. Amsterdam
2. Liverpool (it's the 2008 European Capital of Culture)

Ann
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Jody

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #13 on: October 27, 2007, 04:38:25 PM »
I thinkAllan's idea is a good one as well and I understand the 2 underlying issues affecting all AMG's and that is that non-Americans have difficulty travelling here (a big damned shame it is) and that it is expensive as well and that for many Americans, especially with the dollar at all time lows) it is near impossible to travel abroad.

That being said perhaps in addition to Allan's idea we could divide our choices into U.S. and outside the U.S., though that may complicate things.

Anyway in that vein I would like to go to Europe (a separate AMG???) and I choose Amsterdam and London for that and if it is in this part of the world I choose Seattle and Chicago.

I am flexible (as always) though I cannot bend like I did as a younger man. ;)

Jody   
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 "Try to discover that you are the song that the morning brings."

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Offline milker

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #14 on: October 28, 2007, 12:36:52 AM »
Mexico
Vancouver

3rd runner up Amsterdam
mid-dec: stupid ass
mid-jan: seroconversion
mid-feb: poz
mar 07: cd4 432 (35%) vl 54000
may 07: cd4 399 (28%) vl 27760
jul 07: cd4 403 (26%) vl 99241
oct 07: cd4 353 (24%) vl 29993
jan 08: cd4 332 (26%) vl 33308
mar 08: cd4 392 (23%) vl 75548
jun 08: cd4 325 (27%) vl 45880
oct 08: cd4 197 (20%) vl 154000 <== aids diagnosis
nov 2 08 start Atripla
nov 30 08: cd4 478 (23%) vl 1880 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
feb 19 09: cd4 398 (24%) vl 430 getting there!
apr 23 09: cd4 604 (29%) vl 50 woohoo :D :D
jul 30 09: cd4 512 (29%) vl undetectable :D :D
may 27 10: cd4 655 (32%) vl undetectable :D :D

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Offline mrtallguy

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #15 on: October 28, 2007, 09:58:25 AM »
We should not support a country that does not support us!
(And yes, I am referring to the one I live in...UGH!)
So my vote is for:

1)  Amsterdam
2)  Vancouver
I AM DETERMINED TO SEE THINGS DIFFERENTLY!
--ACIM

Offline 404error

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #16 on: October 28, 2007, 02:45:20 PM »
1) Amsterdam
2) Not America
A social critic who promotes equality...

Offline JR Gabbard

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #17 on: October 28, 2007, 03:02:08 PM »
Checked the calendar, and yup--only one month since the last one, but it seems like a LOT longer.  So now for the next one....

I'm breaking your rule, Dennis.  I'm going to offer several location suggestions, because we are a very varied group, with various needs.

First, I agree with everyone who objects to holding it in the US, because our laws are unaccetably restrictive.  In a very real way, until we change them, we will have to accept their consequences.  In this case, the consequence we have to deal with is that many don't want to come here, with good reason.  If we want to get together as a group, then, we have to choose someplace else.  I'll give those suggestions a little later.

Because I still don't want to necessarily give up on the idea of holding it in the US again.  I know the law is fucked.  But unless I missed something, everyone who came got in, this time.  And deep down inside, don't we all already feel like somewhat of an outlaw anyway, no matter where we are, just by having the virus?  

Many members are on public benefits, and holding AMG in the US will make it easier for some poorer members  to attend.  There is more involved in international travel, and for an American who isn't used to it, there is an additional "start up" cost involved.  So if we are going to have it somewhere else, we will need to get very real about how much scholarship support we can get for those who will need it.

So, with those thoughts in mind, my suggestions:

Domestic:  Denver, CO; it is beautiful, relatively cheap, central to most, has AIDS history (the Denver Principles conceived there, obviously) and it's not Texas ('scuse me)   OR

Chicago, IL (it's like a shiny toy); it's beautiful, relatively cheap, central to most, the upper midwest is wonderful that time of year, and it's not Texas('scuse me again)

Not that I don't like Texas, in fact I've liked all of them.  I just wouldn't feel comfortable around so many Repub........

International:  Amsterdam, NL; will solve one very major logistical dilemma that many of us will encounter in other locations, is pretty and quaint, perfect jumping off point for quick forays to other parts of the Continent for those so inclined, and in truth, my choice.

Mexico, DF only:  not so HIV friendly in other places, except perhaps PV.  Now there's a thought.  AMG on the beach at Puerto Vallarta would not suck.  Not at all.  Or Maui, but that's domestic.  And who cares??

So, there's my thoughts.  The money thing is a serious issue.  We should try to make it as available as possible to everyone.  But I don't think that holding it in Amsterdam necessarily makes it less accessible.  We'll just have to pass the hat more.
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Offline manchesteruk

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #18 on: October 28, 2007, 06:42:38 PM »
I'd have to go with Vancouver or Amsterdam.  It looks increasingly likely to me though that there will be two gatherings next year, one in Europe and one in the US/Canada.  There are a lot of people who would feel uncomfortable traveling to the US with it's HIV restrictions and a lot of people in the US who can't afford to travel to Europe.  It's a sad situation but one I can't see a way around unfortunately.

Chris
Diagnosed 11/05

"Life is too important to be taken seriously" Oscar Wilde

Offline heartforyou

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #19 on: October 28, 2007, 07:01:58 PM »
1.Boston, Mass
2.Vancouver.Canada

In Europe : Amsterdam

Good idea Allan

Hermie
Diagnosed in 1987 and still kicking
Viread, Kivexa (Epzicom),Viramune once daily

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Offline Blixer

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #20 on: October 28, 2007, 07:42:28 PM »
US Locations
1.  Boston, MA
2.  Denver, CO

International
1.  Amsterdam

And I realize there is no way to please everyone in this very diverse and fantastic group.
David
Diagnosed 1/9/06
8/27/2007 CD4 598, 29%, VL 58 (72 wks)
11/19/2007 CD4 609, 30%, VL < 50 (84 wks)
2/11/2008 CD4 439, 27%, VL <50 (96 wks)
5/5/2008 CD4 535, 28%, VL <50 (108 wks)
10/20/2008 CD4 680, 28%, VL <50 (132 wks)
Changed to Atripla in 2012
1/14/2013 CD4 855, 35%, VL <40

Offline Ann

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #21 on: October 28, 2007, 07:47:09 PM »
Um, am I just nit-picking, or were we asked to give just two locations?
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline newt

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #22 on: October 28, 2007, 08:29:39 PM »
Douglas, Isle of Man

The Isle of Man is located at the heart of the British Isles, putting it within easy reach of England, Ireland, Scotland and Wales.

Alternatively, somewhere in Texas

- matt
"The object is to be a well patient, not a good patient"

Offline LACboi

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #23 on: October 28, 2007, 11:03:37 PM »
 1. Cancun Mexico - we can see Mayan temples, pyramids

 2. Toronto Ont, Canada - 1st AMG reunion

 3. Vancover BC, Canada


Offline woodshere

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #24 on: October 29, 2007, 10:29:39 AM »
Boston or DC
"Let us give pubicity to HV/AIDS and not hide it..." "One of the things destroying people with AIDS is the stigma we attach to it."   Nelson Mandela

Offline pozattitude

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #25 on: October 29, 2007, 11:08:50 AM »
I agree with SweetPrince in that we should find the most economical place for everyone so all who want to attend can be at AMG next year.

on a personal preference,

where?  I am going to be selfish and suggest L.A.  why? AIDS LifeCycle ends in L.A and I would just love to see your faces as I pedal into Los Angeles...there is a HUGE closing ceremony for the ride and that can be our arrival party, also PRIDE week in L.A that week

otherwise...
in the U.S I say New York or Miami/Ft. Lauderdale
in Latin America ..Mexico City or San Juan
in Europe... Manchester or Rotterdam

Asia/Oceania has to be  in Sydney or Perth


POSITIVE PEDALERS... We are a group of people living with HIV/AIDS, eliminating stigma through our positive public example.

Offline David_CA

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #26 on: October 29, 2007, 06:57:02 PM »
I was told that Vancouver would be a fairly expensive  location for a gathering.  I was also told that this is is why it wasn't a suggested location for a previous AMG.  Is this not correct?  Perhaps we need to keep in mind the practicality involved in any location we suggest. 

Price - I mean, Amsterdam would be great, as would London.  The costs involved for getting attendees to anywhere not in North America are going to be very high.  The exchange rate pretty much sucks right now for US citizens to travel to Europe.

Weather - I see Texas suggested.  Isn't Texas a bit hot in August & September.  How's Mexico City's weather this time of year.  We need a location that's fairly moderate in temperature.  The location needs to be one that's not (likely) to be affected by hurricanes. 

Time of year - Are we planning the AMG in August or September?  That has implications for those who teach or have young kids in school, what else is going on in a potential location (conferences, tourist season, etc), and also on weather.

Legality of travel - I know our non-US brothers and sisters have the issue of HIV travel to contend with.  I can understand their dilemma.  To say that we as a country don't welcome HIV+ travelers is just not true.  Like I've said before, it wasn't too long ago (3 years, as I recall) that laws making sex between same-sex partners were enforced.  The Supreme Court finally did the right thing in declaring these laws unconstitutional.  I'm not sure how effective these laws were at cutting down on gay sex, but I have a feeling they weren't at all.  The point is that if something is unlawful, but doesn't hurt another, many folks don't have an issue breaking that law.  I guess the point is that I'm personally sorry that we have some archaic, BS laws regarding HIV.  I'm also sympathetic to the concerns of those dealing with these laws.  I also know that the vast majority of AMG attendees are US citizens. 

If one is going to suggest a location for an AMG, perhaps a bit of research on various locations prior to recommending them is in order.  I'd think that having visited a place fairly recently at the time of year in question would suffice as research. 

I think Allanq's idea above is also a good one.  I'll do a little preliminary research over the next few days and see what options I can come up with, but I think the US or not-US issue needs to be settled pretty early on.

David

Black Friday 03-03-2006
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Online Miss Philicia

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #27 on: October 29, 2007, 07:14:39 PM »
Florianópolis

or

Bodrum
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline pozattitude

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #28 on: October 29, 2007, 07:27:46 PM »
Florianópolis

or

Bodrum

where the hell did you find Florianópolis?...lol...don't get me wrong..it is a nice city on the beach and the capital of the state where it sits, but if we are going all the way South I'd say lets do Rio or Buenos Aires.
POSITIVE PEDALERS... We are a group of people living with HIV/AIDS, eliminating stigma through our positive public example.

Online Miss Philicia

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #29 on: October 29, 2007, 07:35:25 PM »
where the hell did you find Florianópolis?...lol...don't get me wrong..it is a nice city on the beach and the capital of the state where it sits, but if we are going all the way South I'd say lets do Rio or Buenos Aires.

I don't like obvious choices :)

...plus it has less crime than Rio.  Everyone from Rio and BA go to Floripa for vacation.  Plus with the unique German racial mixture the boys have a delightful quality to them.
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline Oceanbeach

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #30 on: October 29, 2007, 08:26:49 PM »
I see a couple of members voting on Mexico.  Does anyone remember Manuel and Scot?  Manuel was in a hospital in a Mexico state which did not have AIDS.  He was refused treatment and died.  Many of us here on the Forums sent letters of complaint to the authorities in Mexico and the press protesting Manuels treatment.  I believe Scot was tried for practicing medicine without a license.

If someone could check the Forum archives, I think it could be found in the "old" Forums and this should be reviewed before voting on Mexico.  Have the best day
Michael

« Last Edit: October 29, 2007, 11:02:28 PM by Sonomabeach »

Offline pozattitude

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #31 on: October 30, 2007, 01:04:53 AM »
I don't like obvious choices :)

...plus it has less crime than Rio.  Everyone from Rio and BA go to Floripa for vacation.  Plus with the unique German racial mixture the boys have a delightful quality to them.

wow Philly, I'm impressed  :)  where did you learn so much about Brazil?  My mom is from there and my grandfather's family is of German descent, but Jewish....lol.

Rich
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Offline Queen Tokelove

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #32 on: October 30, 2007, 02:24:14 AM »
Man, I just wish I could afford to go to some of the places listed and that includes the ones in the States. I live on a very limited income so traveling abroad for me would mean a passport which I have never applied for one. Of course, I would vote for NY because it is closer to me. I really don't have a second choice but guesses I would like anything that is on the East Coast.... ;D
Started Atripla/Ziagen on 9/13/07.
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Offline manchesteruk

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #33 on: October 30, 2007, 03:59:04 AM »
Legality of travel - I know our non-US brothers and sisters have the issue of HIV travel to contend with.  I can understand their dilemma.  To say that we as a country don't welcome HIV+ travelers is just not true.

I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one David.  Whilst it wouldn't bother me personally to come back to the US next year I can see where other people are coming from.  It's only really because I'm not on meds that it's not much of an issue for me.  If you were found with HIV medications in your luggage you would be sent home it's as simple as that.  In fact I think it's happened to a member of these forums.  And we also have to lie on a visa waiver form as Niki says essentially this its committing a felony everytime we want to enter the country.  It's an extremely nerve racking experience especially when you are being quizzed by immigration officers asking why you are in the country trying to catch you out.

Chris
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Offline David_CA

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #34 on: October 30, 2007, 08:04:39 AM »
I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one David.  Whilst it wouldn't bother me personally to come back to the US next year I can see where other people are coming from.  It's only really because I'm not on meds that it's not much of an issue for me.  If you were found with HIV medications in your luggage you would be sent home it's as simple as that.  In fact I think it's happened to a member of these forums.  And we also have to lie on a visa waiver form as Niki says essentially this its committing a felony everytime we want to enter the country.  It's an extremely nerve racking experience especially when you are being quizzed by immigration officers asking why you are in the country trying to catch you out.

Chris

Chris,

I'm not disagreeing with what you've said.  I did say that it was illegal, but that I doubt most US citizens care.  What I mean by 'we as a country' is your everyday citizen.  Just like I don't think that 'we as a country' approve of the BS going on in Iraq, either.  The official US laws may mean one thing, but that doesn't have anything to do with the population's opinion.  Of course, this doesn't make it any less illegal.
Black Friday 03-03-2006
03-23-06 CD4 359 @27.4% VL 75,938
06-01-06 CD4 462 @24.3% VL > 100,000
08-15-06 CD4 388 @22.8% VL >  "
10-21-06 CD4 285 @21.9% VL >  "
  Atripla started 12-01-2006
01-08-07 CD4 429 @26.8% VL 1872!
05-08-07 CD4 478 @28.1% VL 740
08-03-07 CD4 509 @31.8% VL 370
11-06-07 CD4 570 @30.0% VL 140
02-21-08 CD4 648 @32.4% VL 600
05-19-08 CD4 695 @33.1% VL < 48 undetectable!
08-21-08 CD4 725 @34.5%
11-11-08 CD4 672 @39.5%
02-11-09 CD4 773 @36.8%
05-11-09 CD4 615 @36.2%
08-19-09 CD4 770 @38.5%
11-19-09 CD4 944 @33.7%
02-17-10 CD4 678 @39.9%  
06-03-10 CD4 768 @34.9%
09-21-10 CD4 685 @40.3%
01-10-11 CD4 908 @36.3%
05-23-11 CD4 846 @36.8% VL 80
02-13-12 CD4 911 @41.4% VL<20
You must be the change you want to see in the world.  Mahatma Gandhi

Offline AMG Coordinator

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #35 on: October 30, 2007, 08:41:43 AM »
According to the survey which has been posted for over a month, the choice between US or Europe should not even be an issue.  I understand the qualms our European friends have about visiting the USA.  However, this is a social gathering and not a political gathering.  Where ever we all wind up next year we are there to visit with friends.  Not to make a political statement to the USA or any other country.  I'll post the full results hopefully before I leave for California.  But in short...

72 people participated
55 96.39% reside in the USA
17 23.16% reside elsewhere

     Where do you reside?      
Africa & the Middle East   2   2.78%
Asia                                   2   2.78%
Australia/New Zeeland   5   0               6.94%
Canada                                   1   1.39%
Caribbean                                   7    9.72%
Latin America 0                   0                0.00%
U.S.A. (East Coast)                  16   22.22%
U.S.A. (Midwest)                  10   13.89%
U.S.A. (South)                   11   15.28%
U.S.A. (Southwest)                   5    6.94%
U.S.A. (West Coast)                  12    16.67%

Despite an official ban on people living with HIV from entering the country, would you attend an AMG event located in the USA?      
Yes   64   88.89%
No   8   11.11%

If you answered "NO" to the question above, where do you live. (please answer this question ONLY if you answered no to the question above)      

Not Applicable...I answered yest to question 14   64   88.89%
Africa and the Middle East                                   0   0.00%
Asia                                                                   0   0.00%
Austrailia / New Zealand                                   2   2.78%
Canada                                                                   0   0.00%
Caribbean                                                                   0   0.00%
Europe                                                                   3   4.17%
Latin America                                                   0   0.00%
USA                                                                   3   4.17%

In which location would you like to see AMG 08 be held?   
   
Northeast (New York, Mass.,Vermont, etc.)                                  15   20.83%
Midwest (Illinois, Wisconsin,Ohio, etc.)                                  15   20.83%
Southeast (Georgia, Florida,Louisiana, etc.)                                  12   16.67%
Southwest (Arizona, New Mexico, Nevada, Texas, etc.)                   3   4.17%
West Coast (California,Colorado, Oregon,Washington, etc.)   4   5.56%
Europe                                                                                  14   19.44%
Central/South America                                                                   3   4.17%
Australia/New Zealand                                                                   4   5.56%
Caribbean Islands                                                                   2   2.78%


This vote is going to remain simple.  2 suggested destinations per person (Europe or USA) with the destination receiving the most votes going up for discussion as next year AMG destination. 

Please use the information above and make wise and sound choices when casting your vote.  Please keep in mind the needs of the group as well as the ease and affordability of getting a group of people to a single destination.  Your vote shouldn't be a reflection of your wishes.   I would love to go to Africa.  However, I would never vote for that as a destination for AMG know the majority of members would not be able to attend.   Keep in mind weather, affordability, local amenities, etc.  As of today, September is beating out August and October as the time of year. 

I'm sorry if I'm coming across as harsh.  I guess my point is in order for us to accomplish our goals this needs to be a relatively simple process using the facts as we know them.  We are not going to please everyone.

To keep the tallying of the votes simple, please use this forum to cast your votes rather than discussions about US or European policies on HIV.

Thanks!


Offline Iggy

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #36 on: October 30, 2007, 09:17:37 AM »
According to the survey which has been posted for over a month, the choice between US or Europe should not even be an issue.  I understand the qualms our European friends have about visiting the USA.  However, this is a social gathering and not a political gathering.  Where ever we all wind up next year we are there to visit with friends.  Not to make a political statement to the USA or any other country. 


Actually I don't think you or anyone here can brush aside the legitimate worry of any non-U.S. citizen has of traveling here when there is an official ban by saying that this isn't about politics.  Frankly I find that misguided and somewhat offensive.

It doesn't matter what the gathering is about that is at issue - what is at issue is the risk we ask anyone who is outside the U.S. to take to come into the country.  Granted it seems a minimal risk for many but I ask anyone from the U.S. what right we have to deemed that risk a non-issue? 

I wonder how many U.S. citizens would be willing to take a risk with their safety if there was a ban in another country about letting people with HIV enter.  Hell, I would suggest most U.S. citizens would voice complaints and concerns about traveling to any country were English wasn't the first language. 

And as for the non-political point of AMG - I am shocked that anyone doesn't see a gathering of POZ people who are being open about their status in such an event as not being political.  Yes. This is not an event that is structured around political events, but it is high time that we realize that we are by nature a political issue just by our existence.  Unfortunately I think that loss of vision of something that is so basic is why so many of us feel so hopeless in so many areas.

I think it is time to have an AMG gathering in Europe.  If us in the U.S. do not or can not wish to participate in it for reasons ranging from costs to travel concerns then they might have a better understanding of what some of our fellow members go through every year. 

Additionally might I add something to consider about the AMG and those who take the survey and are regulars here on the forum.  The very fact that many of our members can not attend the AMG (whether fears of restrictions or costs of travel) does affect their willingness to even participate in these surveys and discussions and as a result somewhat skews the results.  I would guess that if the event was held outside of the U.S. (or at the very least was discussed as a viable option and not just brushed aside as something that most don't want) we would have a number of people willing to attend and discuss who previously have not had a major presence in such discussions.  As a community that bills itself as a global one, I think it is time we start acting like it.

And btw - your figures are off:

72 people participated (which btw is a very small number for the amount of members on this site)
55 96.39%  76% reside in the USA
17 23.16% reside elsewhere.

« Last Edit: October 30, 2007, 09:20:48 AM by Iggy »

Offline AMG Coordinator

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #37 on: October 30, 2007, 09:52:09 AM »
Actually I don't think you or anyone here can brush aside the legitimate worry of any non-U.S. citizen has of traveling here when there is an official ban by saying that this isn't about politics.  Frankly I find that misguided and somewhat offensive.

It doesn't matter what the gathering is about that is at issue - what is at issue is the risk we ask anyone who is outside the U.S. to take to come into the country.  Granted it seems a minimal risk for many but I ask anyone from the U.S. what right we have to deemed that risk a non-issue? 

Than what is your solution for next years AMG.  Keep in mind your solution should be one that would be economical and feasible for the group at large.

I wonder how many U.S. citizens would be willing to take a risk with their safety if there was a ban in another country about letting people with HIV enter.  Hell, I would suggest most U.S. citizens would voice complaints and concerns about traveling to any country were English wasn't the first language. 



And as for the non-political point of AMG - I am shocked that anyone doesn't see a gathering of POZ people who are being open about their status in such an event as not being political.  Yes. This is not an event that is structured around political events, but it is high time that we realize that we are by nature a political issue just by our existence.  Unfortunately I think that loss of vision of something that is so basic is why so many of us feel so hopeless in so many areas.

FACT - AMG is STRUCTURED as a social event and not a political event. If anyone wishes to use their participation as political, so be it.  There are no demonstrations or any structured outing that makes this event political. 

I think it is time to have an AMG gathering in Europe.  If us in the U.S. do not or can not wish to participate in it for reasons ranging from costs to travel concerns then they might have a better understanding of what some of our fellow members go through every year. 

FACT - No one has ever stopped AMG from being held in Europe.  Each year there has been a vote put out to the members of AMG.  The process for the past few years have been as democratic as can be on an internet forum.  Please review past threads regarding past AMG's. 

Additionally might I add something to consider about the AMG and those who take the survey and are regulars here on the forum.  The very fact that many of our members can not attend the AMG (whether fears of restrictions or costs of travel) does affect their willingness to even participate in these surveys and discussions and as a result somewhat skews the results.  I would guess that if the event was held outside of the U.S. (or at the very least was discussed as a viable option and not just brushed aside as something that most don't want) we would have a number of people willing to attend and discuss who previously have not had a major presence in such discussions.  As a community that bills itself as a global one, I think it is time we start acting like it.

FACT - The survey has been posted for over a month and has been open to the entire membership of AidMeds.com.  Anyone interested in attending AMG has been invited to take the survey.  If you wanted your voice heard this was one way.  Another way is to vote.
And btw - your figures are off:

72 people participated (which btw is a very small number for the amount of members on this site)
55 96.39%  76% reside in the USA
17 23.16% reside elsewhere.

FACT - I'm human and make mistakes.  Regardless, 8 persons out of the 17 who "reside elsewhere" stated they would visit an AMG if it were held in the USA.  The information, as supplied by those who participated in the survey show that the issue of USA vs Europe is very minor as it relates to AMG.  Aslo, I can only post a link to the survey.  I can't make people take it.  This is one of the few tools the coordinators of this event have to use in the planning process. 


Offline Iggy

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #38 on: October 30, 2007, 09:55:35 AM »
Please read what I wrote again and give some consideration about my point which I think you are missing by a mile.

Offline AMG Coordinator

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #39 on: October 30, 2007, 10:02:28 AM »
Iggy,

I'm not taking this personally.  However, it is partially the responsibility of the coordinator to ensure that decisions are being made that will benefit the GROUP as a whole (yet realizing you won't be able to please everyone). 

If you want AMG to be held in Europe then please cast your vote.

Please, continue to use this thread for casting your vote ONLY. 


Offline David_CA

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #40 on: October 30, 2007, 10:06:22 AM »
Iggy, there has been TALK for some time about an AMG being held in Europe.  This is not a sponsored event.  There is nothing stopping anybody from holding one there.  There have been smaller gatherings there, but nothing as large as the ones here in the US North America. 

As for being 'political', it would be hard for somebody who's not attended an AMG to think of it as political... at least from what I've experienced at two AMG's.  I know I'm only speaking for two (hubby and I), but this was not a political event.  It was not to make a point to anybody.  It's a social gathering, a chance to meet other HIV+ people.  One cool thing about those who've attended, at least to me, is that there seems to be a bit more politeness and respect towards each other, a sort of friendship that's not built from just an on-line forum. 

Also, as an FWI regarding
Quote
I would guess that if the event was held outside of the U.S. (or at the very least was discussed as a viable option and not just brushed aside as something that most don't want) we would have a number of people willing to attend and discuss who previously have not had a major presence in such discussions.  As a community that bills itself as a global one, I think it is time we start acting like it.
two words come to my mind.  Toronto and Montreal, both non-US locations. 

David

(Edited to correct US to North America)
« Last Edit: October 30, 2007, 10:21:36 AM by David_NC »
Black Friday 03-03-2006
03-23-06 CD4 359 @27.4% VL 75,938
06-01-06 CD4 462 @24.3% VL > 100,000
08-15-06 CD4 388 @22.8% VL >  "
10-21-06 CD4 285 @21.9% VL >  "
  Atripla started 12-01-2006
01-08-07 CD4 429 @26.8% VL 1872!
05-08-07 CD4 478 @28.1% VL 740
08-03-07 CD4 509 @31.8% VL 370
11-06-07 CD4 570 @30.0% VL 140
02-21-08 CD4 648 @32.4% VL 600
05-19-08 CD4 695 @33.1% VL < 48 undetectable!
08-21-08 CD4 725 @34.5%
11-11-08 CD4 672 @39.5%
02-11-09 CD4 773 @36.8%
05-11-09 CD4 615 @36.2%
08-19-09 CD4 770 @38.5%
11-19-09 CD4 944 @33.7%
02-17-10 CD4 678 @39.9%  
06-03-10 CD4 768 @34.9%
09-21-10 CD4 685 @40.3%
01-10-11 CD4 908 @36.3%
05-23-11 CD4 846 @36.8% VL 80
02-13-12 CD4 911 @41.4% VL<20
You must be the change you want to see in the world.  Mahatma Gandhi

Offline Iggy

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #41 on: October 30, 2007, 10:16:28 AM »
David - Thanks but you miss the point as well.

I am fully aware of the talk of the AMG in Europe - not sure why you thought I missed that.  Please note what I am talkiing about is based off of what I quoted in my first post which I found as minimizing real concerns of anyone outside the U.S.

You also misunderstood what I mean about the political thing.

Read what I wrote again - "And as for the non-political point of AMG - I am shocked that anyone doesn't see a gathering of POZ people who are being open about their status in such an event as not being political.  Yes. This is not an event that is structured around political events, but it is high time that we realize that we are by nature a political issue just by our existence. Unfortunately I think that loss of vision of something that is so basic is why so many of us feel so hopeless in so many areas."

I'm not arguing or even suggesting that we all put on war paint and charge the white house.  I'm asking us as a group to realize that our very gathering is by nature political (despite how icky that makes some feel).  You can't escape it no matter how much one wishes they could.  Granted a wake up call to that fact may be lost in this discussion, but it is sad that anyone would want to argue for the point that we are less than what we are.


Offline David_CA

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #42 on: October 30, 2007, 10:19:54 AM »
David - Thanks but you miss the point as well.

This seems to happen a lot these days. 
Black Friday 03-03-2006
03-23-06 CD4 359 @27.4% VL 75,938
06-01-06 CD4 462 @24.3% VL > 100,000
08-15-06 CD4 388 @22.8% VL >  "
10-21-06 CD4 285 @21.9% VL >  "
  Atripla started 12-01-2006
01-08-07 CD4 429 @26.8% VL 1872!
05-08-07 CD4 478 @28.1% VL 740
08-03-07 CD4 509 @31.8% VL 370
11-06-07 CD4 570 @30.0% VL 140
02-21-08 CD4 648 @32.4% VL 600
05-19-08 CD4 695 @33.1% VL < 48 undetectable!
08-21-08 CD4 725 @34.5%
11-11-08 CD4 672 @39.5%
02-11-09 CD4 773 @36.8%
05-11-09 CD4 615 @36.2%
08-19-09 CD4 770 @38.5%
11-19-09 CD4 944 @33.7%
02-17-10 CD4 678 @39.9%  
06-03-10 CD4 768 @34.9%
09-21-10 CD4 685 @40.3%
01-10-11 CD4 908 @36.3%
05-23-11 CD4 846 @36.8% VL 80
02-13-12 CD4 911 @41.4% VL<20
You must be the change you want to see in the world.  Mahatma Gandhi

Online Miss Philicia

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #43 on: October 30, 2007, 10:32:45 AM »

I think it is time to have an AMG gathering in Europe.  If us in the U.S. do not or can not wish to participate in it for reasons ranging from costs to travel concerns then they might have a better understanding of what some of our fellow members go through every year. 

I *somewhat* would agree with this statement, but then I look at the stats from the AMG questionnaire (which I'd not seen previously) and I now *somewhat* disagree.
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline Iggy

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #44 on: October 30, 2007, 10:59:10 AM »
Iggy,

I'm not taking this personally.  However, it is partially the responsibility of the coordinator to ensure that decisions are being made that will benefit the GROUP as a whole (yet realizing you won't be able to please everyone). 

If you want AMG to be held in Europe then please cast your vote.

Please, continue to use this thread for casting your vote ONLY. 




ooops.  My apologies:

1. Amsterdam

2. Prague

Offline Lisa

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #45 on: October 30, 2007, 11:11:37 AM »
Chicago or Nashville
No Fear  No Shame  No Stigma
Happiness is not getting what you want, but wanting what you have.

Offline pozattitude

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #46 on: October 30, 2007, 11:13:07 AM »
Given the results of the survey so far, and giving consideration to non stop routes,  I vote for:

US
New York


Europe
Amsterdam

Rich
POSITIVE PEDALERS... We are a group of people living with HIV/AIDS, eliminating stigma through our positive public example.

Offline woodshere

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #47 on: October 30, 2007, 11:26:52 AM »
Chicago or Nashville

oooooooo, like that, change mine to Boston or Nashville
"Let us give pubicity to HV/AIDS and not hide it..." "One of the things destroying people with AIDS is the stigma we attach to it."   Nelson Mandela

Offline Cliff

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #48 on: October 30, 2007, 11:36:28 AM »
I hope people don't rush to judge the location of AMG.  Issues of cost versus US entry requirements are difficult, but they have been considered during the planning of each AMG, (hence why the event was held outside the US for 2 of the 3 events and yet held in Canada to take advantage of exchange rates to still make the event affordable for everyone).  It's unfortunate that we live in an imperfect world, which forces us to make difficult decisions.  But we do.  And with that, my vote is:

1.  Boston
2.  Mexico City

Cliff

Who would love for the event to come to London, but read today that the US Dollar is at a 26 year low against the Sterling and at an all time low against the Euro.   :(

Offline Nico

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Re: AMG 2008 DESTINATION VOTE
« Reply #49 on: October 30, 2007, 02:25:24 PM »
My vote-

US
1 . Boston
2.  New York

Outside US

1. Toronto
2. Amsterdam
Poz since 1990.

 


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