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Author Topic: THE HIV/AIDS generation GAP  (Read 17796 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline allopathicholistic

  • Member
  • Posts: 3,258
Re: THE HIV/AIDS generation GAP
« Reply #100 on: August 24, 2007, 02:40:25 AM »
She'll never make it on the cover of a magazine and she doesn't need to.

Never? ??? Really? How on earth do you know this with certainty?

(Meant to ask you this earlier but anyhue)

Edited to simplify
« Last Edit: August 24, 2007, 04:29:25 AM by allopathicholistic »

Offline AustinWesley

  • Member
  • Posts: 815
    • HIV Discussion Group on Myspace!
Re: THE HIV/AIDS generation GAP
« Reply #101 on: August 24, 2007, 04:22:11 AM »
I'm part of the "older" generation but I sympathize with the younger generation. Ideas that come from some LTS that I don't agree with include:

Younger people don't think AIDS is a big deal. Maybe it's living in NC but no one I know wouldn't freak out if they found out they had HIV. There are people I know who wouldn't want me to touch them or hold their baby if they knew I was HIV+. If HIV is no big deal then why do so many people on here get turned down for sex or dumped when they disclose their HIV status? It's still a big deal.

Education is going to stop HIV. The reality is many people knew all about HIV before they were infected. They knew about condoms. They knew friends and lovers that died. They became infected anyway, and I'm part of "they". Educating people about HIV and condoms is important but it won't solve the problem. It's not all about ignorance, it's about human nature.

You're naive to think medications are going to save you. If it wasn't for medications the LTS wouldn't be here. When I was diagnosed I was told I might live 5 years. Yet here I am 14 years later and my life is good. I've had side-effects and problems but the reality is 95% of the time I'm fine. Being told "just you wait, you're going to get sick" isn't productive. Medications keep improving and no one knows what the future holds. Being told I had 5 years screwed me up, particularly financially.

You don't appreciate my sacrifice. Respect is something that is given freely, you can't demand it. It's commendable to tell your story and the story of people who are no longer around to tell theirs. People will respond to honesty and true sacrifice. Telling people "you owe me" or "you're too young to understand" isn't going to earn any sympathy. As the saying goes "Get off the cross, we need the wood."

Ford,

You have restored my faith in humanity with your eloquent and thoughtful words on the subject!  If your were on American Idol I'd have voted for ya ; )

Well said!   Appreciate you sharing your perspective!

Much Respect to you!

Wesley
Diag. 3/06  Infected aprx. 2 mo. Prior
Date        CD4   %      VL
4/6/06     627    32    36,500     NO MEDS YET!
6/7/06     409    27    36,100
8/23/06   408    25     22,300
1/2/07     354    23     28,700
2/9/07     139    30     23,000  Hep A Vaccine same day???
2/21/07   274    26     18,500 
3/3/07    RX of Truvada/Sustiva Started.
4/5/07    321     27      Undectable 1st mo.  
5/16/07  383     28    Undectable 2nd mo.
8/10/07  422     32   UD <48 on new scale!

Offline Tim Horn

  • Member
  • Posts: 799
Re: THE HIV/AIDS generation GAP
« Reply #102 on: August 24, 2007, 07:07:17 AM »
You sound like a walking, talking version of the NAMBLA literature I remember reading around 1978. There's a word for men in their 30s who consort with teenage boys, and it's called pedophile.

Bucko:

This is flamebaiting, pure and simple -- and you know it.

Yes, buca45 says that he took to older gay men as a part of his experience as a rural gay teen and indicates that this was an affirmative factor in his development. Such relationships are what we've encouraged between young members and "older" members of these Forums. To accuse him of sounding "like a walking, talking version" of NAMBLA literature is totally off base and downright nasty, in light of the fact that you've been an effective older role model yourself.   

This is the second time you've crossed the line this week. Consider this a second warning -- next time, it's straight to Time Out. 

Tim Horn
« Last Edit: August 24, 2007, 08:40:17 AM by Tim Horn »

Offline NycJoe

  • Member
  • Posts: 236
Re: THE HIV/AIDS generation GAP
« Reply #103 on: August 24, 2007, 08:54:30 AM »
Without calling names and just giving a personal opinion...If I found out that some 30 or 35 yo man was hanging around my 13-14yo nephew..I would be like..wtf?!  I would totally lose it.  That..as someone said..IS creepy..and dangerous...Joe

Offline Andy Velez

  • Global Moderator
  • Member
  • Posts: 24,414
Re: THE HIV/AIDS generation GAP
« Reply #104 on: August 24, 2007, 08:59:44 AM »
OK folks, I suggest that it's not necessary for Buca and those who have gotten pissed off at him to exchange any more tits for tats. That just continues more of the same at a rising level of nastiness. So I am asking ALL to cease and desist from it right now.

For those who care to I suggest re-focusing on the theme of the thread. With regard to that I want to say that we are just at the beginning of dealing with the challenge of multi-generations living with HIV. As each new generation comes along, with everything else they need to learn, in a sense the wheel of learning about living with HIV has to be re-invented for them. That's challenging enough in itself. What makes it even more so here in the U.S. is this is a country that is so f****d about sexuality in general that it makes it even harder to deal with anything that is sexually related.

Note for example how often the word "admit" is used when referring to someone's non-straight sexuality whether person is well known or not. Admit is like confessing something. How about "acknowledge" as an alternative. The choice of a word is important.

So in the context of how I see American society malfunctioning in general, it's not surprising that a new generation is getting short changed on sexually-related information. The thing is EVERYONE is getting short-changed on that one.  

I suggest we need to develop and implement effective ways to reach people of all ages about HIV issues. And we have to do that in the context of a country which still stigmatizes those with HIV in a mindset of "us" and "them," and which country has never given a rat's ass about the epidemic as a whole, and just wants it to go away so they can go shopping, look young forever, make lots of money in the stock market, and otherwise live in non-reality shows instead of what I would call real life.

So this is a hard job and it's not made any easier by people pontificating and sniping at each other. But maybe really that's just another of the obstacles we need to figure out how to overcome.

    
Andy Velez

Offline Peter Staley

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,337
  • Founder & Advisory Editor, AIDSmeds.com
    • AIDSmeds.com
Re: THE HIV/AIDS generation GAP
« Reply #105 on: August 24, 2007, 12:38:03 PM »
I think you're a condescending asshole that's way too impressed with himself and his own opinions.

Wow, and this thread had been an amazing read for awhile.  Mouse, if someone insults you, use the "Report to moderators" link -- don't post an insult in return.  As far as the mods are concerned, caustic comments in response to someone else's caustic comments are just as bad as the original comments.  They can lead to Time-Outs.

Please use the moderator link in the future.

Thanks,

Peter

Offline LatinAlexander

  • Member
  • Posts: 599
  • Bogota, Colombia
Re: THE HIV/AIDS generation GAP
« Reply #106 on: August 24, 2007, 01:18:10 PM »
On my personal experience, I was never close to any gay man older than me, until I was 18 (Adult according to my country laws). But in the same way that I think that a young person must grow up in an environment of different cultures (And that is what a exchange students programs are meant to), I think that having older lesbians and gays around you can be very benificial, from -multiple points of view, like Respecting People, learning to behave in a given environment (just like lions with younger lions), learning how to socialize in the environment to which they will belong.

A critical aspect of this (specially fo gay guys, affected by the HIV) is that if we would see the effect of certain dangerous behavior, then we would be able to not make certaing decissions. For instance: A family that sees a relative dying because smoking and lung cancer, may reject the idea of smoking, improving health.  Very probably, I wouldn't have engaged in certain behaviors if i had seen gay people (that would have eased the taumatic process of accepting owns sexuality), and perhaps If I would have seen gay friends dying of AIDS, I would have had a better vision. 

But the fact that we are non-heterosexuals, implies that we challenge a society (In the same way women and black people did), and thefor there is an inherent effort to reject differences. That is called non-tolerance in front of diversity

Alex
Poz since Jul 19 2006
Initial numbers : CD4-250 VL 3500
First labs after HAART (Dec 04-2006) : CD4-432 VL-<40 (Undetectable)  cd4%=25.11%
Started HAART: Combivir+Efavirenz Aug 26 7:38 pm
Feb 08 2007 - Gradually stopping HAART cause of Myalgia. Protecting Efavirenz. Stopped Efavirenz, ahead with Combivir....
February 17 Combivir stopped.
April 3 -07 : Started ddi+3tc+efavirenz...
Gay and positive (What a lack of Identity...:) )
Looking for my Ben....

Offline Bucko

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,947
  • You need a shine, missy!
    • The Spin Cycle
Re: THE HIV/AIDS generation GAP
« Reply #107 on: August 24, 2007, 02:50:55 PM »
Bucko:

This is flamebaiting, pure and simple -- and you know it.

Yes, buca45 says that he took to older gay men as a part of his experience as a rural gay teen and indicates that this was an affirmative factor in his development. Such relationships are what we've encouraged between young members and "older" members of these Forums. To accuse him of sounding "like a walking, talking version" of NAMBLA literature is totally off base and downright nasty, in light of the fact that you've been an effective older role model yourself.   

This is the second time you've crossed the line this week. Consider this a second warning -- next time, it's straight to Time Out. 

Tim Horn


Tim-
I shall not attempt to justify my words over the last several days, as both you and Peter have found them in breech of etiquette. As I have no wish to be denied access to the support I receive here at AIDSmeds, I'll thank you for your feedback and acknowledge this as my second warning.
Blessed with brains, talent and gorgeous tits.

The revolutionary smart set reads The Spin Cycle at least once every day.

Blathering on AIDSmeds since 2005, provocative from birth

Offline StrongGuy

  • Member
  • Posts: 492
Re: THE HIV/AIDS generation GAP
« Reply #108 on: August 24, 2007, 02:57:28 PM »
Wanted to just clarify (can't edit my post above - time's up I guess) that I agree with the perceptions that exist which Iggy noted, but in no way agree with most of the characterizations as facts or truths in any way shape or form.

Mike :)
(who found this thread interesting up until fights were provoked)
"Get your medical advice from Doctors or medical professionals who you trust and know your history."

"Beware of the fortune teller doom and gloomers who seek to bring you down and are only looking for company, purpose and validation - not your best physical/mental interests."

"You know you all are saying that this is incurable. When the real thing you should be saying is it's not curable at the present time' because as we know, the great strides we've made in medicine." - Elizabeth Edwards

Offline tigger2376

  • Member
  • Posts: 462
  • too bad to die youngish!
Re: THE HIV/AIDS generation GAP
« Reply #109 on: August 24, 2007, 09:36:52 PM »
frankly all i care about is that we're all still here, (just about) and coping, (just about). whether newbie or lts, gay or straight, we all are aiming for the same thing, to stay alive. yes of course we're going to disagree, bitch and kvetch, because we're all human...just having the virus doesnt mean we'll get on/agree neccessarily. whats important is that we give a damn.
i do  ;D
I know i'm going to enjoy the party in the afterlife, but do you all mind that I'm going to be VERY late!!!

Offline AlanBama

  • Member
  • Posts: 3,604
  • Alabama: the 'other' 3rd World Country!
Re: THE HIV/AIDS generation GAP
« Reply #110 on: August 24, 2007, 11:32:51 PM »
well said, tigger !

You know how your parents always said "we don't want you to make the same mistakes we made".....they wanted you to be safe and protected.   But you had to make some mistakes, in order to learn and grow.   I think that is the way a lot of us long-termers feel, we just hate to see the young ones make such a big mistake....the difference is, unlike the ones your parents typically warn you about, this shit can kill you.

One of the things that gives me the most joy from our AMG's is the diversity:
young and old, and we all get along great together and have a wonderful time and a lot of laughs.  (except some of us can't get out of bed the next day...)  ;)

hugs,
Alan
"Remember my sentimental friend that a heart is not judged by how much you love, but by how much you are loved by others." - The Wizard of Oz

Offline AustinWesley

  • Member
  • Posts: 815
    • HIV Discussion Group on Myspace!
Re: THE HIV/AIDS generation GAP
« Reply #111 on: August 24, 2007, 11:41:37 PM »
OK folks, I suggest that it's not necessary for Buca and those who have gotten pissed off at him to exchange any more tits for tats. That just continues more of the same at a rising level of nastiness. So I am asking ALL to cease and desist from it right now.

For those who care to I suggest re-focusing on the theme of the thread. With regard to that I want to say that we are just at the beginning of dealing with the challenge of multi-generations living with HIV. As each new generation comes along, with everything else they need to learn, in a sense the wheel of learning about living with HIV has to be re-invented for them. That's challenging enough in itself. What makes it even more so here in the U.S. is this is a country that is so f****d about sexuality in general that it makes it even harder to deal with anything that is sexually related.

Note for example how often the word "admit" is used when referring to someone's non-straight sexuality whether person is well known or not. Admit is like confessing something. How about "acknowledge" as an alternative. The choice of a word is important.

So in the context of how I see American society malfunctioning in general, it's not surprising that a new generation is getting short changed on sexually-related information. The thing is EVERYONE is getting short-changed on that one.  

I suggest we need to develop and implement effective ways to reach people of all ages about HIV issues. And we have to do that in the context of a country which still stigmatizes those with HIV in a mindset of "us" and "them," and which country has never given a rat's ass about the epidemic as a whole, and just wants it to go away so they can go shopping, look young forever, make lots of money in the stock market, and otherwise live in non-reality shows instead of what I would call real life.

So this is a hard job and it's not made any easier by people pontificating and sniping at each other. But maybe really that's just another of the obstacles we need to figure out how to overcome.

    

Heya Andy,

I hadn't looked at it this way before, but I agree that we are constantly having to reinvent the wheel as things evolve over time.  That was an interesting take on the subject and I would agree.

Personally, I know as I have learned so much over this last year and a half my beliefs have changed.   As an example when I was first diagnosed I thought how could anyone have children or put them at risk.  Now, I realize that the risk has become fairly insignificant if the proper precautions are taken.  I'm merely using this as one example.   And a lot of that has to do with newer technology, scientific studies and it's still constantly changing!

Tigger, I would also agree with what you've said.  HIV sure makes for strange bedfellows eh?  : )  We've all been thrown into the mix and it's true that we aren't all going to ever agree on everything.  Hell, if we could do that then we'd have to strive for world peace too ; )

Anyways, I have found this topic interesting overall despite some of the other issues.   Some people have put a great deal of thought into their posts.  I see it as a step in the right direction.

Wesley
Diag. 3/06  Infected aprx. 2 mo. Prior
Date        CD4   %      VL
4/6/06     627    32    36,500     NO MEDS YET!
6/7/06     409    27    36,100
8/23/06   408    25     22,300
1/2/07     354    23     28,700
2/9/07     139    30     23,000  Hep A Vaccine same day???
2/21/07   274    26     18,500 
3/3/07    RX of Truvada/Sustiva Started.
4/5/07    321     27      Undectable 1st mo.  
5/16/07  383     28    Undectable 2nd mo.
8/10/07  422     32   UD <48 on new scale!

 


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