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Author Topic: How do you handle user harassment???  (Read 8834 times)

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Offline xyahka

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How do you handle user harassment???
« on: August 04, 2007, 10:01:51 AM »
I am facing harassment from an old time user from this forums, he first tried to get me into troubles yesterday night and being that he didn't win, he left me a message today in my personal blog menacing me. How would you handle this situation???

I've already blocked this user, but he keeps on bothering me. It is strange how this person who seemed to be nice for many (including me long time ago) can become so agressive and hostil. I am sad for him, and i understand he might be facing some kind of troubles he is not able to cope with... that's why i don't "disclose" his name nor the comment he just posted in my blog. Any advice?

Juan Carlos
(Feeling quite happy today... and understanding others who need harassment to feel they are alive... it's ok sweety, don't worry... things will get better. kisses  ;)  :-*)
13/03/07 1er diagnóstico /Peso: 79kg
19/04/07 CD4: 494 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 80kg
19/07/07 CD4: 659 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79.5kg
06/03/08 CD4: 573 (después de meses muy deprimido) /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79kg
17/09/08 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 84Kg
06/02/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 85Kg /HCV: Neg /HBV: Neg.
07/03/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg / Gym 3días/semana y Natación 2días/semana.
12/05/09 CD4: 470 /Cviral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg.
08/07/09 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 77Kg.
09/12/09 CD4: 510 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg. No medicinas aún
10/01/10 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
15/05/10 CD4: 320 /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
01/02/11 CD4: 291 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
05/05/11 CD4: 366 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
27/07/11 CD4: 255 /CViral: 138000 /Peso: 78kg.

Disfrutando y aceptando una nueva vida...

Dan J.

  • Guest
Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2007, 10:07:45 AM »
Report this person to the moderators. There is a link in every post or personal message Report to Moderator on the bottom right side or each post or PM.

Dan

Is there a posibility of an English version of your blog? I have wanted to read it several times, but I don't know Spanish.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2007, 10:10:07 AM by Dan J. »

Offline Ann

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2007, 10:12:13 AM »
Juan,

I don't think it's any mystery who you're talking about, in this or the other thread you started in off topic.

To say he was trying to "get you into troubles" is a bit of an exaggeration, don't you think? I believe people have a right to know if you're using their posts or blogs in a context other than the one originally posted.

You know, a simple "I'm sorry" and "I'll ask before I do that again" would go a long way to make this matter go away.

Sheesh.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Dachshund

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2007, 10:21:10 AM »
I'm sure there is always two sides to every story. If you post something about someone by name in your personal blog it seems like they should have every right to respond. Harrasment is a serious charge and shouldn't be bandied about lightly. Others might be able to make the same claim.

Offline xyahka

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2007, 10:23:41 AM »
Ann... i think lately you might not be reading my posts COMPLETELY or perhaps my english is too few for you... The thing is i already excused myself. Plese go and re read that thread.

Being that i already appologized and that i don't talk to this member since SEVERAL months ago... when i receive a message in my personal blog calling it names and menacing me... i think that's harassment... ahh but as he is your friend, you might think different about it... cultural understanding, right? I have tons of that :). That's why i haven't reported him yet to moderators, i mean i like the guy, he is funny... he is just dangerous and agressive sometimes.

When i find it right.. i might do report him with someone who will be really impartial.

Juan Carlos (loving his real life and not worrying about virtual issues)
13/03/07 1er diagnóstico /Peso: 79kg
19/04/07 CD4: 494 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 80kg
19/07/07 CD4: 659 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79.5kg
06/03/08 CD4: 573 (después de meses muy deprimido) /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79kg
17/09/08 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 84Kg
06/02/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 85Kg /HCV: Neg /HBV: Neg.
07/03/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg / Gym 3días/semana y Natación 2días/semana.
12/05/09 CD4: 470 /Cviral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg.
08/07/09 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 77Kg.
09/12/09 CD4: 510 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg. No medicinas aún
10/01/10 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
15/05/10 CD4: 320 /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
01/02/11 CD4: 291 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
05/05/11 CD4: 366 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
27/07/11 CD4: 255 /CViral: 138000 /Peso: 78kg.

Disfrutando y aceptando una nueva vida...

Offline Dachshund

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2007, 10:30:00 AM »
Look Juan Carlos, we all know you're talking about Matty. You are being disingenuous by failing to mention that none of this took place in your aidsmeds blog. It took place in another blog you have and you were the first to mention Matty by name. I repeat, citing harassment can come back and bite you on the butt. I'll save you the trouble...yes, I am a friend of Matty.The. Damned.

Offline Ann

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #6 on: August 04, 2007, 10:33:46 AM »
Juan,

No where have I seen you say that you were SORRY to anyone, nor have you promised to ask people before using their stuff again.

From what I can see on your personal blog, you named this person by name and launched a tirade against him. Now you're surprised he made a comment on the blog, IN your blog, not here at AIDSmeds.com?

And I still can't get over the fact that despite the fantastic command of the English language you display when it suits you, you continue to use your "too few" English to hide behind - again when it suits you. You're not fooling anyone.

As far as anyone being my friend here, when it comes to issues of moderation here in the forums, I treat people the same as far as humanly possible. Just ask some of the people I've given Time Outs to in the past.

Ann

Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline xyahka

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2007, 10:39:52 AM »
I am being serious when i say harassment. My post mentions what happened yesterday in other thread and says what i think about it. Several of my friends from here and out of here have read it, and since i shared the menace this guy posted with them (i haven't published cause i don't want to get him into troubles) all my friends think there is something wrong with him and adviced me to post this thread to make others aware of the attack i am receiving. By the way i haven't say who is... so you can't be sure whom i am talking about until i say it ;).

I know the comment came in my personal blog, i mentioned this before. The fact is that this member got my personal details from here. So i came here to post this.

I wasn't the first one talking nor mentioning this person, i don't talk to this person since several months ago. Although if you think you know who is and you are friend of this person then you can tell him not to waste his time with me. I am not here for fighting, game playing... i came here to try to help others.

I have a real life... don't need virtual games. I only post this here to let him know i am not interested in playing his game as for the rest, i am done with it.

Juan Carlos (who only like soccer games)
13/03/07 1er diagnóstico /Peso: 79kg
19/04/07 CD4: 494 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 80kg
19/07/07 CD4: 659 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79.5kg
06/03/08 CD4: 573 (después de meses muy deprimido) /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79kg
17/09/08 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 84Kg
06/02/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 85Kg /HCV: Neg /HBV: Neg.
07/03/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg / Gym 3días/semana y Natación 2días/semana.
12/05/09 CD4: 470 /Cviral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg.
08/07/09 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 77Kg.
09/12/09 CD4: 510 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg. No medicinas aún
10/01/10 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
15/05/10 CD4: 320 /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
01/02/11 CD4: 291 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
05/05/11 CD4: 366 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
27/07/11 CD4: 255 /CViral: 138000 /Peso: 78kg.

Disfrutando y aceptando una nueva vida...

Offline Ann

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #8 on: August 04, 2007, 10:45:28 AM »
Quote
By the way i haven't say who is... so you can't be sure whom i am talking about until i say it

Juan, stop insulting my intelligence. I don't like it.

You know, I can't help but feel you knew you were doing wrong when you lifted what people have written and put them into you "private" blog. Why? Because you seem to normally reproduce your other blog on your AIDSmeds blog. Except for the ones where you've stolen people's posts. Odd.

And as for "I'm not playing games"... again, don't insult my intelligence.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Dachshund

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #9 on: August 04, 2007, 10:48:47 AM »
I will wait till you post his name. ;) I will also remind you harassment is a double edged sword and accusing others of harassment when photos and chat logs linger in cyberspace is hypocritical at best.

Dan J.

  • Guest
Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2007, 10:52:38 AM »
 I read your personal blog & feel Matty had every right to respond. My advice to you would be to drop it. You say you don't need all this virtual drama, but here you are starting 2 threads about it. Get a grip.

If you use words posted by another forum member in your blogs or  from another persons aidsmeds blog the polite thing to do would be to ASK THEM FIRST BEFORE YOU USE THOSE WORDS.

Danny



« Last Edit: August 04, 2007, 01:15:38 PM by Dan J. »

Offline xyahka

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2007, 10:56:36 AM »
I think i posted a question, if someone has a suggestion regarding that question then post it, as for your assumptions of who i am talking about... it is up to you guys. I haven't given any name ;)

Cheers,

Juan Carlos

(who clarifies that post about using ignore function was about someone completely different...mmm people get confused some times.)

/edited to add/

Yes Ann, i will ask before using other's words next time.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2007, 10:58:10 AM by xyahka »
13/03/07 1er diagnóstico /Peso: 79kg
19/04/07 CD4: 494 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 80kg
19/07/07 CD4: 659 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79.5kg
06/03/08 CD4: 573 (después de meses muy deprimido) /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79kg
17/09/08 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 84Kg
06/02/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 85Kg /HCV: Neg /HBV: Neg.
07/03/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg / Gym 3días/semana y Natación 2días/semana.
12/05/09 CD4: 470 /Cviral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg.
08/07/09 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 77Kg.
09/12/09 CD4: 510 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg. No medicinas aún
10/01/10 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
15/05/10 CD4: 320 /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
01/02/11 CD4: 291 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
05/05/11 CD4: 366 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
27/07/11 CD4: 255 /CViral: 138000 /Peso: 78kg.

Disfrutando y aceptando una nueva vida...

Offline Ann

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #12 on: August 04, 2007, 10:58:50 AM »
Quote
(who clarifies that post about using ignore function was about someone completely different...mmm people get confused some times.)

Why lie?

Sheesh.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline RapidRod

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #13 on: August 04, 2007, 11:00:18 AM »
Your blog gives his name. This isn't the place to coming crying when you have done something wrong and got called on it.

Offline Dachshund

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #14 on: August 04, 2007, 11:00:56 AM »
I think i posted a question, if someone has a suggestion regarding that question then post it, as for your assumptions of who i am talking about... it is up to you guys. I haven't given any name ;)

Cheers,

Juan Carlos

(who clarifies that post about using ignore function was about someone completely different...mmm people get confused some times.)


Give me a break...talk about playing games, we ALL know who you put on ignore. If you can't be honest about that, then why should anyone believe anything else you say?

Offline Matty the Damned

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #15 on: August 04, 2007, 11:11:26 AM »
Look, here's the skinny.

I discovered Juan's english language blog on google sometime back and not from these forums. And I visited it yesterday. Note I'm talking about his personal blog. Not his spanish language AIDSMEDS blog.

You can visit it by clicking here.

And it turns out the Juan has been taking posts that people make in this place and articles from AIDSMEDS bloggers and quoting them selectively for his personal blog. In particular he used a very poignant and sensitive thread from Living With started by Cowandalehouse and selectively quoted a number of people including Christine, Basquo and Queen Akasha.

It was pretty clear that Juan hadn't done the courteous thing and asked these people if they minded, he just appropriated their stuff. So I very carefully and politely made this known in that thread and left it at that.

Today I read Juan's blog again only to find that he posted a pissy article about my actions yesterday. So I commented on his blog. Nothing menacing or threatening. I just let him know that I too have a blog (with several thousand readers) and that I would be quite happy to write an article about him in return.

You know, blogger to blogger.

I would be more than happy for Juan to post my comment on his blog. I said nothing there that I'd have a problem with anyone knowing about.

People need to understand that Juan is annoyed because he was busted taking other people's stuff and quoting it  selectively and without appropriate permission. And he's been back pedalling ever since. He's desperate to paint Matty the Damned as the daemon here. Picking on poor little Juan who can barely speak english.

The reality is that Brother Juan has been busted stealing other people's work and he doesn't like being called out for it. Perhaps Juan might like to look up the words 'ethical' and 'unethical' in a spanish dictionary.

At no time have I ever harrassed Juan in these forums. I've never monstered him in a thread or via PM. It should be noted that all the threads about this have been started by Juan. Outside of my small post in Living With, I've said nothing else publicly about this in these forums.

And quite frankly, judging by the responses he's getting it seems nobody is really buying his guff.

But people can believe what they want. Read these threads. Take the time to read his blog. As I said earlier you can go there by clicking on the link I've provided above.

I'm more than happy for Juan to make any comment I've made on his blog public. I've got nothing to hide in any of this.

I hope Juan can say the same.

MtD

Offline Ann

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #16 on: August 04, 2007, 11:37:18 AM »
Here's the thing, Juan.

Yes, this forum is a public forum on the internet. However. This forum operates on a certain level of trust and respect. When you take people's heartfelt words and post them - without permission - somewhere else, then you violate that trust. You erode the foundation of this forum.

This trust isn't a matter of language, it transcends language. It's a matter of having respect for your fellow forum members. Respect acts the same, no matter what language it speaks.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline MoltenStorm

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #17 on: August 04, 2007, 11:46:26 AM »
All you have to do, Xyahka, is the following, and this will be water under the bridge (read: be forgiven).

1. Apologize for taking those posts without permission.
2. Promise that you will get the poster's permission before using their post in your blog.
3. Live by that promise.

Simple. Sweet. As a bonus, it keeps this episode from being drawn out unnecessarily, and we can all get back to the wonderful world of posting without such unpleasantness. :)

It's understandable that in the moment of being scared by what you read that it slipped your mind, but it was a violation of a trust that we hold here. Easily correctable, and easily forgiven.
"Love is always patient and kind. It is never jealous. Love is never boastful nor conceited. It is never rude or selfish. It does not take offense and is not resentful. Love takes no pleasure in other people's sins, but delights in the truth. It is always ready to excuse, to trust, to hope, and to endure whatever comes." - 1 Corinthians 13:4-7, adaptation in A Walk To Remember

CD4: 555 / 29% / Undetectable - 7 Nov 2006
CD4: 555 / 29% / Undetectable - 5 Feb 2007

Offline Carolann

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #18 on: August 04, 2007, 12:31:17 PM »
Juan,

To be fair, I think Ann is pretty impartial. She has warned me before when I have I have let my gut do the posting. I tried to find where Matty threatened you and have found nothing. All he asked you to do was to show common courtesy and ask for permission before posting the personal thoughts of people on our forums.

Matty is crusty and cantankerous beyond his years, but therein lies his charm. It took me a while to get used to his abrasive edge, and realize that has been through a lot and has suffered with this disease. These are factors we all have to take into considerattion when dealing with one another. I for one have seen him be a lot tougher on people who have taken it like a man, so to speak. My advise to you is to toughen up. If Matty gets your knickers in a bunch, HIV will certainly get your panties in an uproar.

Blogging is not for sissies and neither is HIV. We all could benefit from having a thick skin.

I think what people dislike is mistating the facts. I have still to see the part where matty is going to come, huff and puff and blow your house down, like the big bad wolf. Perhaps a better use of your time would be to spend more time meeting your quotas at work, so you can pay your light bill,  and not junk up cyberspace with picutres of pizza and posts about scatalogical eruptions.

Carolann (who says fight the real enemy HIV and not each other)

Offline Sdgirl

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #19 on: August 04, 2007, 01:03:20 PM »
I'm just curious..........................what Juan did in his personal blog is deplorable.  And, as a fellow blogger, who practically have to give blood,  her first born child and a promissory note to become a blogger, why would AIDSMEDS continue to allow him to blog on their site? 

Is it because you are trying to capture the hispanic HIV/AIDS audience?

Just curious
"Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate.  Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure.  It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us.  We ask ourselves.."Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous?  Actually, who are you not to be?"

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #20 on: August 04, 2007, 01:17:05 PM »
Juan, do yourself and everyone else a favor and stop defending yourself. Frankly I find it to be disingenous of you to not understand or to not have anticipated people would object to having their words quoted outside of the Forum setting without asking their permission.

To me that is the core issue here. One of the most basic tenets of this site is safety. It is because of that sense of protection here that everyone can write openly, in the certainty what is said will not be misused.

This back and forth doesn't serve anyone well. What needs to be clear is that this won't happen again. No quoting from threads without asking that person if it's ok. Seems pretty simple to me.

As soon as you make it clear that you're in sync with that principle the problem ought to be over.
Andy Velez

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #21 on: August 04, 2007, 01:26:16 PM »
SD, your comments about what you supposedly had to go through to become a blogger and raising the ethnic issue are totally gratuitous potstirring.

They serve no good purpose and are exactly more of just what we don't need. So lay off of that stuff right now.

Consider yourself warned.
Andy Velez

Offline Tim Horn

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #22 on: August 04, 2007, 01:28:51 PM »
Juan:

Enough. Your command of the English language has nothing to do with this. The fact is, you can read the fact that people are visibly upset with your personal blog -- not your AIDSmeds.com blog -- and its use of messages posted in these Forums. If anything, you know enough of the English language to be extremely passive-aggressive in your responses to people here.

You say this when responding to Ann in another thread: "If it was rude for you, i excuse myself. " This isn't an apology... this is turning the tables. And your little smiley faces don't help matters either.

As Andy and others have said, all that's needed here is for you to apologize, to say that you won't do it again, and to let this multiple-thread drama drop. You've received knowledgable feedback from others -- pointing out that deafness is not an established complication of cytomegalovirus infection -- and should leave it at that. If you have something to add to the discussions regarding hearing loss as it may or may not relate to HIV infection, please say it here.

Tim Horn

Edited to add: if you're being harassed by and AIDSmeds.com Forums member, you are encouraged to take this up with the moderators of these Forums. You've been here long enough to realize that we have moderators to deal with this sort of thing: forums@aidsmeds.com

« Last Edit: August 04, 2007, 02:40:32 PM by Tim Horn »

Offline Queen Tokelove

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #23 on: August 04, 2007, 07:48:23 PM »
I have received many pms telling me what Juan did and if you haven't seen the link that Matty is talking about check it out. He quoted me word for word but then abbreviates my name? Is the abbreviation of my name suppose to be protecting me? Then he turns around and blatantly lies and says he asked for permission. Normally, I would be pissed about this but why feed into the madness? An apology would be nice although I would have to question it's sincerity.
Started Atripla/Ziagen on 9/13/07.
10/31/07 CD4-265 VL- undetectable
2/6/08 CD4- 401 VL- undetectable
5/7/08 CD4- 705 VL- undetectable
6/4/08 CD4- 775 VL- undetectable
8/6/08 CD4- 805 VL- undetectable
11/13/08 CD4- 774 VL--undetectable
2/4/09  CD4- 484  VL- 18,000 (2 months off meds)
3/3/09---Starting Back on Meds---
4/27/09 CD4- 664 VL-- undetectable
6/17/09 CD4- 438 VL- 439
8/09 CD4- 404 VL- 1,600
01-22-10-- CD4- 525 VL- 59,000
Cherish the simple things life has to offer

The Royal Blog

Offline emeraldize

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #24 on: August 04, 2007, 10:29:29 PM »
Perhaps better than an apology would be a blog retraction or edit. Admittedly, not being a blogger, I'm assuming that you can go back into the text and modify it. Juan...based on this assumption, why not go clean up the e-mess as a sign of your understanding the degree to which this is offensive to those whom you quoted? Paraphrase. Start anew. Whatever. But, why not make it right?

Offline xyahka

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #25 on: August 04, 2007, 10:35:21 PM »
HI everybody,

I think i did apologized about this before, but if it wasn't clear i can do it again, i have no trouble doing it since i didn't desire to harm anyone.

Excuse me, I am sorry and I won't quote your comments literally again without asking your permission.

Please accept my apologies to the members and moderators. I wish that notice of my fault was given to me in private, as this problem would have been fixed in minutes, instead of using a method that can only lead to stirring up trouble and emotional reactions for all involved parties.

I want to thank you for your understanding.

Juan Carlos


13/03/07 1er diagnóstico /Peso: 79kg
19/04/07 CD4: 494 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 80kg
19/07/07 CD4: 659 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79.5kg
06/03/08 CD4: 573 (después de meses muy deprimido) /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79kg
17/09/08 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 84Kg
06/02/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 85Kg /HCV: Neg /HBV: Neg.
07/03/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg / Gym 3días/semana y Natación 2días/semana.
12/05/09 CD4: 470 /Cviral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg.
08/07/09 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 77Kg.
09/12/09 CD4: 510 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg. No medicinas aún
10/01/10 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
15/05/10 CD4: 320 /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
01/02/11 CD4: 291 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
05/05/11 CD4: 366 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
27/07/11 CD4: 255 /CViral: 138000 /Peso: 78kg.

Disfrutando y aceptando una nueva vida...

Offline emeraldize

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #26 on: August 04, 2007, 10:45:23 PM »
It appears you've already edited the "names" of those whom you quoted to be simply an initial or two. So, I've found the answer to my previous wonderment about the ability to edit a blog. They're like any other document it seems.

That you made minor revisions to the author signatures doesn't get at the core issue, Juan, which is that you lifted text, without permission of the posts' authors and/or owners of AidsMeds.com. For those who are interested...link to Juan's blog http://juanca.nomadlife.org/default.aspx
« Last Edit: August 04, 2007, 10:48:16 PM by emeraldize »

Offline Ann

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #27 on: August 04, 2007, 10:50:04 PM »

I wish that notice of my fault was given to me in private, as this problem would have been fixed in minutes, instead of using a method that can only lead to stirring up trouble and emotional reactions for all involved parties.


Juan Carlos


Juan, people had a right to know this was going on. By the way you've conducted yourself in these couple threads, it's obvious you had no intention of telling anyone here what you'd been up to.

The point is, it shouldn't have happened in the first place. As I said, it's a matter of breaching people's trust and that is disrespectful. It's simple courtesy to ask someone before you use their words - their inner most thoughts and fears - and all the more so on a support forum for people living with a stigmatised disease. Somehow I get the feeling you still don't "get it". Or at least you're pretending that you don't.


I wish that notice of my fault was given to me in private, as this problem would have been fixed in minutes, instead of using a method that can only lead to stirring up trouble and emotional reactions for all involved parties.


You seem to think it's a case of "what they don't know, won't hurt them".

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Iggy

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #28 on: August 04, 2007, 11:28:03 PM »
Perhaps better than an apology would be a blog retraction or edit. Admittedly, not being a blogger, I'm assuming that you can go back into the text and modify it. Juan...based on this assumption, why not go clean up the e-mess as a sign of your understanding the degree to which this is offensive to those whom you quoted? Paraphrase. Start anew. Whatever. But, why not make it right?

Agreed.

Offline Carolann

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #29 on: August 04, 2007, 11:33:36 PM »
Juan,

If you are really sincerely sorry then you can rectify the matter by deleting the words that you have taken without permission from others.  It took no esoteric or special knowledge of internet law or ettiquette to know that the words that appear on this website belong to Smart and Strong, because as a member of this website, you agreed to these terms.  If you fail to rectify the matter perhaps the impacted parties should complain directly to Smart and Strong for this breach of the contract you agreed to when joining Aidsmeds as they, as well as Smart and Strong are the injured parties.

True, our laws may not touch you personally in Ecudor, but the owners of this website have the ultimate discretion as to who may use it both as a member and a blogger.  I suspect that you enjoy the platform this website provides and would hate to lose the opportunity to share your rare insights with the world.

Why not just rise to the occaision by showing that you are sorry by removing the words you have stolen.  As they say (and I am sure it is said in many, many languages....) Actions speak louder than words.

Offline xyahka

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #30 on: August 04, 2007, 11:40:07 PM »
Hi Ann, thanks for your comments, I said i was sorry for the mistake. Coming from a different country where internet is not controlled i was not aware i would break copyrights and offend people, here we have a different way of thinking. That's why i didn't find it wrong at beginning but now i know it.

I hope you are open to understand I just overreacted because i was terrified and still am. I think we all know how it feels. I know now i had the wrong reaction.

You said earlier this forum operates on a certain level of trust and respect. Don't you trust me when I say Ok I made a mistake?, and you cannot believe that I would have fixed the problem had I been notified in private?.

What is this about "what they don't know won't hurt them?" You never make mistake, do you? And would you prefer being notified about your mistake in front of a an audience that becomes a jury, when I would have fixed the problem in a more efficient way had I been notified in private, remove the posts, and ask for permission from all the members I quoted

I have only 4 months in this forums and i haven't been involved in troubles... I'm here in sound of peace, like american indians say...

I will put this to rest and I hope everyone does too. Once more thank you for your understanding.

Juan Carlos

[attachment deleted by admin]
13/03/07 1er diagnóstico /Peso: 79kg
19/04/07 CD4: 494 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 80kg
19/07/07 CD4: 659 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79.5kg
06/03/08 CD4: 573 (después de meses muy deprimido) /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79kg
17/09/08 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 84Kg
06/02/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 85Kg /HCV: Neg /HBV: Neg.
07/03/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg / Gym 3días/semana y Natación 2días/semana.
12/05/09 CD4: 470 /Cviral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg.
08/07/09 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 77Kg.
09/12/09 CD4: 510 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg. No medicinas aún
10/01/10 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
15/05/10 CD4: 320 /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
01/02/11 CD4: 291 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
05/05/11 CD4: 366 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
27/07/11 CD4: 255 /CViral: 138000 /Peso: 78kg.

Disfrutando y aceptando una nueva vida...

Offline Carolann

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #31 on: August 04, 2007, 11:46:09 PM »
Juan,

Put your money where your mouth is and really put it to rest by the removing the words you ripped from the mouths and hearts of others.  You can rectify this matter by fixing the problem.  Until you do, all your words represent very little.


Offline Dachshund

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #32 on: August 04, 2007, 11:57:03 PM »
All this could have been avoided Juan if you had just said in the original post of Alain's that you wouldn't do it again. Hell, you didn't even need to apologize, you could have said you didn't realize you made a mistake and let it go at that. People would have understood and moved on. The reason the debate continued is because YOU started two new threads. You accuse Matty of harassment and then, because you haven't mentioned him by name, insult our intelligence by trying to tell us you weren't talking about him in the first place. If you didn't want this to be aired in the forums then you should have never started this thread in the first place. It all could have been that simple.

Offline Carolann

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #33 on: August 05, 2007, 12:12:46 AM »




 like american indians say...



Juan, like the american indians say.....

You speak with a forked tongue.  Until your actions match your sentiments I for one see you as being insincere.  The first step you could take, knowing that the taking of the words and innermost intimate feelings of others and using it without the permission of those individuals is still being usurped by remaining on your blog, would be to immediately delete what you have thoughtlessly taken.

Until the words are removed from your blog you are still actively violating the rules of this website and basic ethics not to mention common law copyright law. 


Edited to add:

I have a problem with a person mining this website for material for their own blog.  Someone using my pain to gain attention really upsets me.  I have shared feelings here and details that I have not shared with close personal friends, because I felt that this was a place where I could do so somewhat safely.  The feeling of safety here is built on mutual respect and consideration.    This blatant lack of both respect and consideration by you Juan makes me feel like I would feel in an open  shower knowing that one of the people showering next to me was taking pictures and sharing them with others.  Sure,  you could say that I stood before you naked, but my consenting to be naked in front of others equally naked does not give any of those others the right to share my bare flesh with the invisible eyes of clothed strangers.

We come here, often emotionally naked, but we feel that we are in an environment condusive to that degree of self disclosure.  To take our bare and raw thoughts, feelings, and emotions and share them with those we have not agreed to share ourselves with is beyond creepy.  It is exploitative.  You are exploiting our lives so that you might gain attention. 

To know that this is how we feel and to leave our naked words on your blog is the height of insult and insensitivity.

« Last Edit: August 05, 2007, 12:28:08 AM by Carolann »

Offline Basquo

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #34 on: August 05, 2007, 12:51:27 AM »
Juan Carlos, although I don’t appreciate the contents of my PM being made public on your blog (and it was not a public reply in the forums, but a PM in response to yours) I do thank you for removing my screen name as well as the others. If one were to Google "Queen Akasha Poz" the FIRST thing that pops up is aidsmeds.   When I first Googled "Alain Poz" the forums popped up first, too, but I just tried it again and I got a bunch of French websites.  If you Google "Basquo Poz," you get 6 results, most are from aidsmeds.  The results have changed over the last half hour, though, and now some posts I made on thebody.com a long time ago are showing up, go figure.

Please don’t believe that there are “millions” of Queen Akasha’s, Alain’s or Christine’s on the Internet. There are not.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2007, 12:53:57 AM by Basquo »

Offline Queen Tokelove

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #35 on: August 05, 2007, 02:09:18 AM »
"Please don’t believe that there are “millions” of Queen Akasha’s" says Basquo....

I have heard of  others with the name Akasha but never another Queen Akasha...*snaps fingers* Cause when I was made they broke the mold..Heeeeeeeeey.... ;)


(who tries to make light of the situation)
Started Atripla/Ziagen on 9/13/07.
10/31/07 CD4-265 VL- undetectable
2/6/08 CD4- 401 VL- undetectable
5/7/08 CD4- 705 VL- undetectable
6/4/08 CD4- 775 VL- undetectable
8/6/08 CD4- 805 VL- undetectable
11/13/08 CD4- 774 VL--undetectable
2/4/09  CD4- 484  VL- 18,000 (2 months off meds)
3/3/09---Starting Back on Meds---
4/27/09 CD4- 664 VL-- undetectable
6/17/09 CD4- 438 VL- 439
8/09 CD4- 404 VL- 1,600
01-22-10-- CD4- 525 VL- 59,000
Cherish the simple things life has to offer

The Royal Blog

Offline allopathicholistic

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #36 on: August 05, 2007, 02:32:45 AM »
If you Google "Basquo Poz," you get 6 results, most are from aidsmeds.  The results have changed over the last half hour, though, and now some posts I made on thebody.com a long time ago are showing up, go figure.

Shoot, when you type my name in Google all you get is bunnies, kitties, Disney, etc  >:(  :D

« Last Edit: August 06, 2007, 10:08:56 AM by allopathicholistic »

Offline Bucko

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #37 on: August 05, 2007, 04:38:06 AM »
JC-

On Friday, 8/3, 8:03PM you published this on your blog, most of which seems to be a transcript of a letter sent to a friend at Poz Magazine:


Hi... i think i did a big mistake and started a big trouble....

You will kill me .

Yesterday night, i read a post in poz forums from a guy who is facing deaf after hiv... i wasn't sure if it was hiv related (never heard about it)... i pm some old members of forums to ask them if this was possible, i was not aware of such risk but when i had finished pm them... they were offline already.

I was frankly nervous and shocked... i even didn't post a comment to that thread cause i didn't know what to say and i didn't want to say "sorry... is this you are facing due to living with hiv??". As i was very nervous, i decided to write about it in my blog... NOT about the thread of this person, but about the fear i felt and how surprised i am of knowing this is possible. I did reproduced the original post of this person and two comments that got me equally impressed and a pm reply i received from a forums member about this. I would like to ask you to read what i wrote http://juanca.nomadlife.org

I did though about it before posting, i mean if it was right to post the original post and the 2 comments (not sure if posting a pm i received could be wrong). I though that since i didn't give the url to the thread (though mentioned it was from poz forums) and since i didn't put the identities of this people in risk (since there could be millions alain, queen
akasha, christine in the world, plus in the forums they don't use their real name so in fact they are impossible to locate) and since the post was NOT about them but about how i felt when i read what they wrote... i though it would not be bad.

Today morning i got a comment from the user matty.the.damned saying it was moot from my side to post those comments and he posted a comment mentioning my blog in the original thread this guy started.

Then i came to realise i perhaps did it wrong, perhaps i should have only post the url link to the forum so my friends could read what i was talking about. My personal blog (the one i have since over a year ago and way long before diagnosed) is read by my friends only, i don't promote it anywhere cause it is a personal diary for me where i write about my feelings and what makes me fear, i did disclosed my status there long time ago and i have found some of my friends who read it have understood the way i face the diagnosis and got to see hiv from a different point of view. The reason i write it in english is because i have friends from ukrain, russia, estonia, ecuador, usa, and other places who randomly check my blog and post comments. I have also wrote in my blog several personal experiences and telling others how i felt to try in some way to break the stigma they might have towards diagnosed people. Still with it, my blog does not receive many visits i think 20 per day (since it is intended only for my friends so i don't promote it).

Well, the thing is that right now... i am feeling bad. I never meant to hurt anyone nor to "put things for other consumption" like matty.the.damned says.... i was writing about something i just discovered yesterday night and i didn't know before and that got me extremely scared.... i wrote to queen akasha, aztecan, basquo asking them about this....i mean if it was possible to be deaf due to hiv. An Ecuadorian friend was the one who confirmed it to me... and i was terrified. To write my blog is a way of venting for me, i could not vent this in the forums since in other times i have heard others hating "sky falling"attitude, which was a bit of what i felt last night...i still have a lot to learn about this disease. The other reason behind my post was to tell my friends who are not poz, that they should be more considerated with people who are deaf, cause i understand it could be my case in some years...

You know i could have only post the url address and it would perhaps have been better, anyways whoever who is not member of the forum only a guest could read the thread and understand what i was talking about. I just though that if i would have done it, people could have seen for instance queen akasha's pic, and i didn't want to put them in exposition. So i wrote about something i read and touched me... once again i didn't write ABOUT THEM, but ABOUT HOW I FELT DISCOVERING I COULD BE DEAF, BLIND after some time.

In my same blog i have copied posts from Regan and Lisa for example but i have provided a link for their blogs because i think it would not be a problem if others find them and their blogs, also it was a way to promote them. I didn't do that this time cause it was not my intention to promote anything, i was only coping something i read somewhere on internet and got me impressed... if you read the post it would be easier to understand.

Yeah, well perhaps i did it wrong but i didn't find it wrong nor risky for anyone when i wrote since i didn't provide a way to locate them, and it was not about anyone, but about an opportunistic infection and how it could affect me after some time.

well... i feel very bad now, i hope others will understand i didn't mean to hurt anyone.


Then, 36 minutes later, you write:

Ok i change oppinion. I am not taking vacation of Poz Forums i will be in there as usual.. after all, i haven't done anything wrong.

I like to help people and have made good friends in there, so i will stay and try to keep on helping people and sharing my hope for a good future for everyone.


How is saying that you "did nothing wrong" an apology?

Why would you say "Hi... i think i did a big mistake and started a big trouble...." if you did nothing wrong?

Brent
(Who reads things very carefully)
Blessed with brains, talent and gorgeous tits.

The revolutionary smart set reads The Spin Cycle at least once every day.

Blathering on AIDSmeds since 2005, provocative from birth

Offline sweetasmeli

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #38 on: August 05, 2007, 05:57:28 AM »
My my. I have one afternoon/evening off and I miss all the action in this place! ::)

I too read what Brent read on Juan's personal blog and duly noted the "i haven't done anything wrong" part.

Juan, you have 30+ responses from members here and in other threads - three of whom are moderators - telling you that you did in fact do something wrong.

You say here:
Quote
I will put this to rest and I hope everyone does too.

but your words on your personal blog totally undo any apologies you may have offered here with the one sentence:
Quote
i haven't done anything wrong
(quoted from JC's personal blog).

You started this thread knowing full well that you could have conducted this discussion in private with the moderators, who you also know are the best ones to answer your question.

Please. Stop treating the members and moderators here like fools. And stop behaving like a 'burro'.

Melia
« Last Edit: August 05, 2007, 06:01:49 AM by sweetasmeli »
/\___/\       /\__/\
(=' . '=)    (=' . '=)
(,,,_ ,,,)/   (,,,_ ,,,)/ Cats rule!

The difference between cats and dogs is that dogs come when called, whereas cats take a message and get back to you.

Yeia kai hara (health and happiness) to everyone!

Offline RapidRod

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #39 on: August 05, 2007, 06:36:15 AM »
Juan, you didn't remove anything you archived it and everyone has access to your archives. 

Offline Ann

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #40 on: August 05, 2007, 08:42:39 AM »

You said earlier this forum operates on a certain level of trust and respect. Don't you trust me when I say Ok I made a mistake?, and you cannot believe that I would have fixed the problem had I been notified in private?.


Juan, no, quite frankly, I don't believe a word that comes out of your mouth now. You lied to this forum repeatedly yesterday. You breached all our trust in a very fundamental way. Trust you? You've got to be kidding.


What is this about "what they don't know won't hurt them?" You never make mistake, do you? And would you prefer being notified about your mistake in front of a an audience that becomes a jury, when I would have fixed the problem in a more efficient way had I been notified in private, remove the posts, and ask for permission from all the members I quoted


Sure, I make mistakes. And I fully expect to be pulled on them when I do. However, after reading all your posts both here and on your blog, it would seem that to your mind, the only mistake you made was getting caught.

At this point in time, after all that has happened in the past two days, your apologies are worthless and hollow. The only thing that will change that is time. You're going to have to rebuild trust with everyone here, not just me.

And here's an English saying for you to look up:

Once bit, twice shy.

Maybe you should just go away for a while.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Matty the Damned

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #41 on: August 06, 2007, 02:17:58 AM »
he first tried to get me into troubles yesterday night and being that he didn't win, he left me a message today in my personal blog menacing me.

I was away yesterday and this morning and I think I should make something else clear to people here.

Firstly, I'd like to acknowledge that Creighton's (Basquo) did not post in Alain's thread, rather Juan Carlos reproduced a PM that Creighton had sent him.

Despite what Juan claims in his OP, it was never my intention to "get him into troubles". My purpose, as I stated earlier, was to let people know what he was up to on his blog with respect the things we share here in these forums. This was never some sort of fight that I sought to "win". The fact that Juan would characterise it in this way reveals, I think, quite a bit about his character.

Before I posted about this in Alain's thread in Living With, I discussed the matter at some length with other Forums members of long standing, most notably Aunty Doxie. His judgement is always spot on and I value his advice greatly. I considered starting a new thread about this matter, but decided in the end to simply post in Alains thread, because it was germane to that discussion and I didn't want the matter to blow out into an all singing all dancing flamewar.

At all times in this tacky affair, I have acted in a careful, deliberate and considered way. I remember the debates some months back about CSI:NY and the concerns a lot of members have about their contributions here being appropriated by others in ways that were not originally intended.

I did not for a single moment relish revealing what Juan had done. I'd rather he'd not have done it in the first place. Alain, Christine and Queenie are three people I'm very fond of and it upset me considerably to see their stories and experiences prostituted on some blog without their knowledge or consent. Unlike Juan, I think it a great privilege that people share these things with us here. It's something to be respected not abused in the way that Juan has seen fit to.

I also think it's an enormous shame that Juan has not dealt with his fellow AIDSMEDers with the same degree of honesty, respect and sensitivity that he's been shown in his time with us. Like others I don't believe that his grudging apology is at all sincere. His petulant and childish reaction to this matter has revealed him to be mendacious and singularly untrustworthy.

Not only that, Juan has no right to be angry or feel aggrieved. That he now finds his tit in the wringer is entirely the  product of his own foolishness. He has justly earned the opprobrium of other Forums members and it's quite sad to see that he doesn't understand that. For a 30 year old man, he has a lot of growing up to do.

I hope that Juan's selfish and ill-conceived actions don't discourage other poz people from participating in this place and sharing their stories and experiences with their brothers and sisters. As others have noted this place is built on a foundation of trust and collegial goodwill. It is most regrettable that a rogue member has damaged that foundation.

MtD

Offline Queen Tokelove

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #42 on: August 06, 2007, 04:18:25 AM »
Honestly. I am surprised that this thread is still going. I understand that people are a bit pissed at Juan's actions and am surprised at myself for not being pissed. Maybe because I have been a bit blazed lately... ;D..I admit I was shocked to find my words posted somewhere else but appreciates Matty and others for making it known. I think it is quite pitiful that Juan had to take other people's experiences and post them on his own personal blog for a few measly hits and probably some self gratification. Who knows what he says to his friends? He probably makes himself out to be our "savior".

I will not let Juan's selfish actions keep me from sharing my experiences because if I do, I will be making a step backwards instead of forward. And I know what I share on these forums are helpful to somebody. Some of the people on this forum have been very supportive and helpful. I will not walk away or lurk in the cut.

It is too bad that Juan couldn't get timed out or something for this offense. Ann was being nice by saying leave for awhile, I think it should be for good. But then again maybe he should be allowed to stay because now everyone knows his word isn't worth sh*t and who would want to talk to him?
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Offline Dragonette

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #43 on: August 06, 2007, 05:12:10 AM »
I want to say something, but my English is probably not refined enough to convey it properly. Yes, he made a mistake, posting those excerpts. I don't beleive for a second that he did it to aggrandize himself or whatever. His bigger mistake was to jump headfirst into this argument with a "bring it on" attitude. But who wouldn't when confronted like this? The whole thing escalated pretty quickly. I am very uncomfortable with this permanent tagging of someone as a lier and unworthy. And telling him to diasppear. Why not just kill himself? Yes I think there is a great degree of cultural misunderstanding. It's a fact that the majority here are native speakers. It's not just knowing the words it's knowing how to use them at the right time and in the right way that is so hard. I don't know. I think this could have been dealt with differently, an email from the mods telling him that quoting from the forums is not allowed. Even a blunt message with a threat - stop or you'll be timed out.
I really think this begun as an inoccent mistake and escalated into something ugly. Boycott. Clique. Righteousness. These are the associations that spring to my mind. Now flame/boycott me if you want. I am not on Juan's side and I didn't participate in the "appreciation" thread because I really value so many members here that I don't even have a "top 10" of favorites. But this makes me very sad. I didn't see anybody standing up for Juan. Not for what he did, which was wrong, but for who he is. You can call him names but I know he is not the garbage he is made out to be. Not because he is a friend or I am affiliated with him, because I read him here and elsewhere and I see something else. I see someone struggling, as much as anyone else if not more. I see someone who cares, who supports and does things for others. I don't see an asshole, I'm sorry, I just don't see that. He should not have gone all pigheaded and stubborn about this, but I can see that he may have felt cornered and exposed. I am not defending him, I am trying to prevent this black and white judgement because it is going far. I understand that people here need to keep their privacy. I really do. But I don't think we should forget some compassion to one another. We can tell each other off with a base of compassion and not a base of resentment. Is that even English?! The words are, but will you see what I mean?
 
Modified to add: I found that my blog is linked to JCs blog. One day he left a message on my blog asking if I mind that he adds my blog to the list of blogs that he reads. i had no idea he had a blog until Matt's first post about it and I was thinking it was some kind of compliment, like I will now read you regularly from now on. Now I notice that I am on his blog in the list. So, I guess I have to disclose that I am affliated with JC after all. But that is not the reason I wrote this.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2007, 05:37:18 AM by Dragonette »
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Offline sweetasmeli

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #44 on: August 06, 2007, 06:32:00 AM »
I want to say something, but my English is probably not refined enough to convey it properly. Yes, he made a mistake, posting those excerpts. I don't beleive for a second that he did it to aggrandize himself or whatever. His bigger mistake was to jump headfirst into this argument with a "bring it on" attitude. But who wouldn't when confronted like this? The whole thing escalated pretty quickly. I am very uncomfortable with this permanent tagging of someone as a lier and unworthy. And telling him to diasppear. Why not just kill himself? Yes I think there is a great degree of cultural misunderstanding. It's a fact that the majority here are native speakers. It's not just knowing the words it's knowing how to use them at the right time and in the right way that is so hard. I don't know. I think this could have been dealt with differently, an email from the mods telling him that quoting from the forums is not allowed. Even a blunt message with a threat - stop or you'll be timed out.
I really think this begun as an inoccent mistake and escalated into something ugly. Boycott. Clique. Righteousness. These are the associations that spring to my mind. Now flame/boycott me if you want. I am not on Juan's side and I didn't participate in the "appreciation" thread because I really value so many members here that I don't even have a "top 10" of favorites. But this makes me very sad. I didn't see anybody standing up for Juan. Not for what he did, which was wrong, but for who he is. You can call him names but I know he is not the garbage he is made out to be. Not because he is a friend or I am affiliated with him, because I read him here and elsewhere and I see something else. I see someone struggling, as much as anyone else if not more. I see someone who cares, who supports and does things for others. I don't see an asshole, I'm sorry, I just don't see that. He should not have gone all pigheaded and stubborn about this, but I can see that he may have felt cornered and exposed. I am not defending him, I am trying to prevent this black and white judgement because it is going far. I understand that people here need to keep their privacy. I really do. But I don't think we should forget some compassion to one another. We can tell each other off with a base of compassion and not a base of resentment. Is that even English?! The words are, but will you see what I mean?

Dragonette
With respect, it was Juan Carlos who started not just this thread but two threads about the same issue. The issue could and should have been taken up in private with the moderators but Juan chose not to. In both threads he made totally transparent references to Matty. And on top of that he spoke of this issue on his personal blog where this time he not only made blatant references to Matty, but he also declared: "i haven't done anything wrong". That was after posting his letter to Poz mag on the forums in Alain's thread in LW saying that "i think i did a big mistake and started a big trouble....".

Seriously. What are we supposed to think?

I believe it isn't so much Juan's "bring it on" attitude that has aggravated people as much as his back peddling, underhandedness and inconsistency. And I think people are absolutely entitled to react as they see fit.

Add to that the disrespect he showed towards Ann in his other thread http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=14378.msg178846#msg178846, I can completely understand people's reactions here.

I have no doubt that Juan is lurking reading the on-goings since the weekend - and I have no doubt that he will be back again with more words of explanation and apologies of sorts. Unfortunately however, I do doubt how much sincerity his words will be coupled with.

As has been repeatedly pointed out by both members and moderators, one of the fundamentals of these forums is trust. When that trust is broken, people become naturally wary. All that is happening now is people are reacting to an obvious breach of trust by Juan as well as his disrepectful behaviour.

And I'll think you'll find the reason why no-one has been "standing up for Juan" or more to the point, standing up for "who he is" is very possibly because no-one actually knows what to think about "who he is". It's hard enough to be able to do that in normal everyday face-to-face friendships/relationships, without years of getting to know someone. Online? It's nigh-on impossible. Especially when an incident like this happens, where people's trust is shaken.

I do understand what you are saying about being compassionate, of course I do. And as humans, compassion goes a long way, especially in a support forum like this. However, I believe that respect and integrity are equally if not even more essential.

As with all breach of trust issues, my guess with this incident is that time will tell.

Melia 
« Last Edit: August 06, 2007, 06:33:49 AM by sweetasmeli »
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Offline Dragonette

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #45 on: August 06, 2007, 06:44:16 AM »
I get you too. I just wish people would be a bit more careful with what they say, not take it too far to a complete character slander. We all have different sides.
I will stop now, because my English is also "too few" sometimes ;)

PS in 10 days I am crossing the channel, hope you'll be around!
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Offline Dachshund

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #46 on: August 06, 2007, 07:37:48 AM »
Yes, we did witness an attempt at character assassination that backfired. However, it was not directed at Juan. As Melia, and me, and many others have pointed out the resulting firestorm resulted when Juan started this thread with his transparent accusations of Matty. Up to that point no one had even responded to Juan in Alain's post regarding the information Matty had shared. Frankly, I don't think anyone even cared. Immediately after starting this post Jaun began to get sincere advice from forum members unaware of the true meaning behind the thread. I'm sorry, but I was not going to stand by and let him get away with such childish nonsense. When confronted he had the audacity to try and insult our intelligence with the farcical claim, that in reality, he wasn't even talking about Matty. To me, that claim alone shows exactly how Juan really feels about his fellow forum members and his level of respect for us.

Offline Dragonette

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #47 on: August 06, 2007, 07:53:32 AM »
Point taken, message recieved.
i had read the other threads but understood things differently, at the time.

Dragonette (who still somehow hopes for closure & happy end)



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Offline Ann

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #48 on: August 06, 2007, 07:57:05 AM »
Dragonette,

With all due respect, when someone repeatedly tells lies, it is not slander to call him or her a liar.

And as for the language thing, it's an issue because he seems to have "too few" English only when it suits him. I deal with a fair amount of people for whom English is not their first language over in the Am I forum. It's pretty obvious when someone has sincerely misunderstood and when they're playing a game.

I stand by everything I've said to Juan.

This whole thing never needed to become such a dramatic issue. Had Juan come out and apologised when it first came to light what he did, and asked for permission from the people whose posts he used or removed them right away, then it would have been OK. Instead, he chose to do everything but and tell lies in the process.

And by the way, asking someone to go away for a while is NOT the same thing as telling them to go kill themselves.

I see you posted again while I was writing. I too hope for a happy ending. I hope Juan learns from this and becomes a respected forum member, but that's going to take time now. It was for this reason and this reason alone I asked him to go away for a while. 

Ann
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Offline Dragonette

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Re: How do you handle user harassment???
« Reply #49 on: August 06, 2007, 08:16:01 AM »
Ann, I replied you in a PM.
"If you keep one foot in yesterday, and one in tomorrow, you piss all over today". Betty Tacy

 


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