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Author Topic: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos  (Read 10948 times)

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Offline JeffInNYC

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For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« on: April 28, 2007, 10:22:23 AM »
Is it just me or is it annoying hearing this message every time you use one of those touch tone voice response systems?  Even at the ATM machine or the machine to buy my Metrocard, you have the option of choosing Spanish.

Now I do speak some Spanish, so I can use those functions if I choose to and I understand many people dont speak English, but is it right that they do this?  If the official language here is English, is it right that these options are given?

I dont want to sound cold or prejudiced (which I guess I am to some degree), but I have a problem with this....Im not exactly sure why, who knows maybe it is prejudice, but I just wish everyone would speak English which is the official language in the US as far as I know.

Offline Dachshund

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #1 on: April 28, 2007, 10:42:30 AM »
The conservatives on site will agree with you...the liberals will approach this with a more compassionate, nuanced perspective. Bottom line does it really have any major effect on your life? One more button to push, that's all.

Frankly I'm fed up with folks denigrating the glamorous life of illegals, folks accessing social services, etc...a smoke screen for racism.

Offline JeffInNYC

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #2 on: April 28, 2007, 10:46:15 AM »
Well I dont think most illegals have a glamorous life.  I also have no issue with folks assessing social services...thats what its there for. I do roll my eyes when I see people on line at the grocery store using their food stamps on nonessentials....but hey Im not in that situation so who am I to judge?

I guess I probably am racist...probably more so than I would care to admit and more so than Im even aware of.

And youre right, its just one more button to push...and I dont push it. So bottom line, it doesnt affect me at all.  But why do I find it so damn annoying?

Offline milker

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #3 on: April 28, 2007, 10:49:18 AM »
What I find annoying is that it does not recognizes my insults. How difficult is it for a machine to understand "F... Y..." ? Or maybe it's the accent.

Milker.
mid-dec: stupid ass
mid-jan: seroconversion
mid-feb: poz
mar 07: cd4 432 (35%) vl 54000
may 07: cd4 399 (28%) vl 27760
jul 07: cd4 403 (26%) vl 99241
oct 07: cd4 353 (24%) vl 29993
jan 08: cd4 332 (26%) vl 33308
mar 08: cd4 392 (23%) vl 75548
jun 08: cd4 325 (27%) vl 45880
oct 08: cd4 197 (20%) vl 154000 <== aids diagnosis
nov 2 08 start Atripla
nov 30 08: cd4 478 (23%) vl 1880 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
feb 19 09: cd4 398 (24%) vl 430 getting there!
apr 23 09: cd4 604 (29%) vl 50 woohoo :D :D
jul 30 09: cd4 512 (29%) vl undetectable :D :D
may 27 10: cd4 655 (32%) vl undetectable :D :D

Now accepting applications from blowjob ninjas™

Offline Dachshund

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #4 on: April 28, 2007, 11:10:04 AM »
" I guess I probably am a racist"


That's why you find it so annoying...and what I find annoying about posts like this is that it allows people like Izprince to spew hateful, venomous bile. It opens the door for others to equate illegal immigration to positive people accessing social services. We have members using this very forum who believe their tax dollars should never be used to fund Ryan White or ADAP and they have said so.

Annoying is a fly buzzing around in your house that you can't swat...and that ain't worth posting about either.

Offline bocker3

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #5 on: April 28, 2007, 11:36:43 AM »
The conservatives on site will agree with you...the liberals will approach this with a more compassionate, nuanced perspective. Bottom line does it really have any major effect on your life? One more button to push, that's all.

Frankly I'm fed up with folks denigrating the glamorous life of illegals, folks accessing social services, etc...a smoke screen for racism.
I am not convinced that a liberal has a more nuanced view -- perhaps more compassionate, but it is just as plain and absolute as the conservatives you mention (although clearly opposite).  I see nothing wrong with expecting immigrants (legal or illegal) to assimilate to the country they have come to -- a view which would include Americans moving abroad.  Of course, one can not expect that to happen instantly, so there is a need for some multilingual help in the beginning.  If there isn't a push to learn the language of your new country, then we can run into issues (ahhh... there is some of that nuance).  You see, not everyone who disagrees with something that involves another race or another sexual orientation is necessarily racist or homophobic.  I think we are all a bit to free to throw those labels around.  People (on both sides) become so entrenched in their way of thinking and so convinced that their way is the one and true "right way" that they lose the ability to even consider another position in a rational way.
Now, I do believe racism is alive and well in this country and that a whole bunch of people have varying degrees of it.  Consider -- when one equates the denigration of illegals with racism, there is an implication that only "non-whites" would be illegals, one could argue this exhibits a bit of racism itself!

Mike
Atripla - Started 12/05
Reyataz/Norvir - Added 6/06
Labs - Pre-Meds
Sep05 T=350/25% VL98,559
Nov05 288/18%  47,564
Current Labs
May2013 691/31% <20

Offline Basquo

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #6 on: April 28, 2007, 11:44:23 AM »
English is the"official" language?  ???

Offline libvet

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #7 on: April 28, 2007, 12:03:40 PM »
Personally, I think the whole "English only" thing is more about paranoia than anything else.  People get really paranoid when they can't understand people around them and assume they must be up to something sinister.

I'm glad that I don't have any issues with people speaking different languages or providing services in different languages.  It neither picks my pocket nor gores my ox, so why should I care.

I guess some of that comes from the fact that I spent some time in Europe and was absolutely amazed at the number of people who spoke English as a second language which is in sharp contrast to the United States whereas the vast majority of Americans barely have a grasp of their own language.

Perhaps if we put more effort in learning various languages ourselves, there wouldn't be so much of that bizarre offense taken at someone else speaking a different language in the US.

Offline Dachshund

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #8 on: April 28, 2007, 12:17:13 PM »
I would happily debate the issue of immigration and assimilation into our country...it's been going on for over two hundred years.

However, this topic had nothing to do with immigration...it was about someone being annoyed because of perceived inconveniences. I think anyone reading my post in reference to the topic would deduce I was talking about people of color...heck Jeff admitted to his own racism. Typically people are able to nuance the topic bemoaning reverse racism, which in reality doesn't exist. I know, go ahead and give me all your anecdotes proving me wrong.

Offline libvet

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #9 on: April 28, 2007, 12:31:49 PM »

However, this topic had nothing to do with immigration...it was about someone being annoyed because of perceived inconveniences.

To be honest, I just hate those telephone menu trees altogether regardless of the language question.   While at times they are useful, at other times, when you just want to speak to a human being, having to navigate the menu to actually speak to human being is just ridiculous.

What ticks me off the most is when you call up a customer service line of some sort and have to sit through a commercial  before being offered any menu choices at all (i.e., "Did you know that identity theft strikes one in 5 people? Please speak to one of our customer service representatives today about enrolling in our identity protection plan for a low introductory rate").  I keep expecting them them to say "Plus if you act now, we'll throw in a Brazilian Power Crystal, a 50 dollar value, absolutely free!"

Offline BT65

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #10 on: April 28, 2007, 01:02:22 PM »
My ex-mother in law was born here and spoke very little English (she was raised in Texas among Spanish speaking people).  I don't like discrimination based on anything!  I guess what I have to ask myself is "how important is it?"
I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

Offline JeffInNYC

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #11 on: April 28, 2007, 01:15:21 PM »

However, this topic had nothing to do with immigration...it was about someone being annoyed because of perceived inconveniences. I think anyone reading my post in reference to the topic would deduce I was talking about people of color...heck Jeff admitted to his own racism.

Whoa...hold on there Judgemental Judy.  I think we ALL are racist to some degree...you dont know me personally, but Im a very nice guy and I have always given individuals a chance regardless of race, sex orientation, etc.

I cannot control how Izprince or anyone else spews hate.  This is merely a topic I have posted because I find it very annoying to hear the messages. Period.   I have friends in other countries who speak a minimum of 3 languages....some of my friends there even speak 5!  I think its actually pretty cool.  I just find it annoying that everywhere I turn, youre given the option to NOT use English...whether its on the phone, at the ATM machine at the DMV, whatever.

At work I have many colleagues who are from foreign countries.  When they speak to each other in their native tongue, when its of a personal nature, I think is fine.  However, throughout the course of the day Im hearing all these individuals speaking nothing but their native tongue - whether it be Spanish, German whatever.  I think its unfair to the rest of the staff - for many reasons.  And as a manager, I can tell you I have had this complaint come to me many times.  So what do I tell the employees coming to me to complain?  Do I call them racist?

Offline Bucko

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #12 on: April 28, 2007, 01:34:48 PM »
From the Anarchist perspective:

Drive to NH, Vermont or Maine and the official signs welcoming you are written in both English and French. And lest anyone think this is some fuzzy, squishy multi-culti development of the Clinton years, it's not. I remember them as a child. My grandfather spoke no English until his 20s although he was born in Brewer, Maine.

And the Broward County Transit bus that I take most everyday has canned announcements for each stop in two languages: English and Creole (which really is Ebonic French), but no Spanish, although I hear people speaking it all the time.

The US is a country of immigrants and heterogenous cultures. Street signs in the various Chinatowns I've frequented are bilingual, and everyone goes to the various Italian districts for the best canneloni and other treats. Gay ghettos have the nicest cafes and best selection of porn in their video stores.

This is not harmful, It represents our principal strength as a nation. It should be cherished.

Frankly, Jeffie, I'm dismayed by your premise. I thought you thought more out of the box than this.

Brent
(Who is multilingual himself)
Blessed with brains, talent and gorgeous tits.

The revolutionary smart set reads The Spin Cycle at least once every day.

Blathering on AIDSmeds since 2005, provocative from birth

Offline bocker3

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #13 on: April 28, 2007, 01:59:17 PM »
I would happily debate the issue of immigration and assimilation into our country...it's been going on for over two hundred years.
However, this topic had nothing to do with immigration...it was about someone being annoyed because of perceived inconveniences. I think anyone reading my post in reference to the topic would deduce I was talking about people of color...heck Jeff admitted to his own racism. Typically people are able to nuance the topic bemoaning reverse racism, which in reality doesn't exist. I know, go ahead and give me all your anecdotes proving me wrong.

I don't need to debate immigration and assimilation with you -- but for the record, YOU were the one who first brought up illegals in this thread, so don't try to use the argument that someone else went off topic.  In reality, I am probably not far off from your overall position -- I did want to point out, however, that you equated illegals with racism.  You may have expected others to "deduce" that you meant only those of color, but you did not state that.  I did not take anything out of context, I simply read your words.  My main point is that people, in general, are too quick to throw labels like racist around (yes, I know Jeff said that perhaps he was prejudiced - you mentioned racism first).  Just because someone finds something annoying, does not necessarily make him racist.  I certainly do not know him enough to know if he is racist -- so, I will give him the benefit of the doubt.  Nor do I really think that you are racist, but I do think you are too quick to classify others.
Now, on to the topic -- most of these language choices exist because it is good for business, there isn't any sense of altruism going on, it is about the bottomline.  Does it annoy me, not really -- it would be foolish for businesses to write off a large segment of the population.

Mike
Atripla - Started 12/05
Reyataz/Norvir - Added 6/06
Labs - Pre-Meds
Sep05 T=350/25% VL98,559
Nov05 288/18%  47,564
Current Labs
May2013 691/31% <20

Offline libvet

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #14 on: April 28, 2007, 02:05:44 PM »
What's even more amusing is complaining about the irritation of bilingual information services on a site that has an "En Español" link in the top left corner of the menu.

Offline Dachshund

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #15 on: April 28, 2007, 02:14:05 PM »
You miss my point completely...I was trying to point out that topics like this allow others to use it as a smokescreen to present their racist views. Is Jeff a racist...I don't know? Having read his posts in the past I'm inclined to think he isn't...I also applaud him for being honest about his feelings. That said, nitpick my words any way you want...but I know you know what I meant and I will leave it at that.

Offline thunter34

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #16 on: April 28, 2007, 02:19:52 PM »
I think it makes us look a wee bit backward to get up in arms about a second language option.  They have multiple language options all over the place in Europe.  And it isn't just about opening the gates wide open for people to get by without having to learn the official language when they live here and all that.  I think it could also be a recognition that some people from other countries, ya know...visit here occasionally and may not have mastered the mother tongue.  If anything, we should probably have a few more options up there- what with us being this big melting pot & all.
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline milker

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #17 on: April 28, 2007, 02:28:02 PM »
At work I have many colleagues who are from foreign countries.  When they speak to each other in their native tongue, when its of a personal nature, I think is fine.  However, throughout the course of the day Im hearing all these individuals speaking nothing but their native tongue - whether it be Spanish, German whatever.  I think its unfair to the rest of the staff - for many reasons.  And as a manager, I can tell you I have had this complaint come to me many times.  So what do I tell the employees coming to me to complain?  Do I call them racist?
When I visit Austin, TX for work, I have two colleagues that speak my native language there. We speak French together, as long as there is not a visible audience that wouldn't understand what we say. I wouldn't even try to speak French to hide anything to my other colleagues, that would be stupid, I wouldn't know who can understand and who cannot. Rest assured, you can tell your employees that they can ignore the chatter, it's totally irrelevant for them and they would be bored if they could even understand. Tell them it's background noise, just ignore it.

Now if people continue talking in their native tongue with an audience around, then I can understand, it's a lack of respect.

Milker.
mid-dec: stupid ass
mid-jan: seroconversion
mid-feb: poz
mar 07: cd4 432 (35%) vl 54000
may 07: cd4 399 (28%) vl 27760
jul 07: cd4 403 (26%) vl 99241
oct 07: cd4 353 (24%) vl 29993
jan 08: cd4 332 (26%) vl 33308
mar 08: cd4 392 (23%) vl 75548
jun 08: cd4 325 (27%) vl 45880
oct 08: cd4 197 (20%) vl 154000 <== aids diagnosis
nov 2 08 start Atripla
nov 30 08: cd4 478 (23%) vl 1880 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
feb 19 09: cd4 398 (24%) vl 430 getting there!
apr 23 09: cd4 604 (29%) vl 50 woohoo :D :D
jul 30 09: cd4 512 (29%) vl undetectable :D :D
may 27 10: cd4 655 (32%) vl undetectable :D :D

Now accepting applications from blowjob ninjas™

Offline JeffInNYC

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #18 on: April 28, 2007, 02:28:31 PM »
You miss my point completely...I was trying to point out that topics like this allow others to use it as a smokescreen to present their racist views. Is Jeff a racist...I don't know? Having read his posts in the past I'm inclined to think he isn't...I also applaud him for being honest about his feelings. That said, nitpick my words any way you want...but I know you know what I meant and I will leave it at that.

I may be missing the point too...Im very book smart but sometimes I cant think outside the box as one of my hunky compadres has said.
Thank you Doxie for your words and I apologize if I got a bit snippy.

Offline mjmel

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #19 on: April 28, 2007, 02:48:23 PM »
If I were to travel to France or Italy or Spain I would surely appreciate an "English" language option at the ATM or other coin/card operated dispensers/machines. I speak English and a little French. I think it's a good idea to offer several language options here in the US.
More and more businesses are incorporating "global thinking" into their company/corporation policies. i.e. Banks installing ATMs with multi-language options.
It's what we are going to experience more and more of in the years ahead.
xxx,
Mike

Offline JohnOso

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #20 on: April 28, 2007, 03:57:02 PM »
Now if people continue talking in their native tongue with an audience around, then I can understand, it's a lack of respect.

Milker.

This happens ALL the time at work....the other nurses speak in Tagalog quite a bit.  It's not that I feel they are talking about me (as one can always tell), but, hell, I'd like to join in the conversation too.

And just for the record, I know that no one asked, but i've always thought every class in every school should be bilingual (trilingual?) from the 1st grade upward...i mean we all go to school to learn new things, verdad?

Abrazos,
John

Offline Matty the Damned

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #21 on: April 28, 2007, 04:07:51 PM »
Jeffy,

As a gay man from a non-anglo background, you should know better than to post such racist clap-trap.

MtD

Offline thunter34

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #22 on: April 28, 2007, 04:21:08 PM »
This happens ALL the time at work....the other nurses speak in Tagalog quite a bit.  It's not that I feel they are talking about me (as one can always tell), but, hell, I'd like to join in the conversation too.

And just for the record, I know that no one asked, but i've always thought every class in every school should be bilingual (trilingual?) from the 1st grade upward...i mean we all go to school to learn new things, verdad?

Abrazos,
John

I've always thought that at a bare minimum, the sign alphabet should be taught when the letters are being verbally learned.  It would help dissolve one major communication barrier right there.  Good luck getting any ideas like that through, eh?
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline alberche

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #23 on: April 28, 2007, 05:04:54 PM »
Well, dear friends,

I am a bit surprised reading all the posts under this thread...

I am spanish, from Spain, Europe. In my country we speak 4 different languages. Castilian spanish is the official one in all of the country, but we have many regions with their own language and, there, castilian is just cooficial.

Sometimes this supposes some problems, but convivence is possible and it works very well.

Watching a bit wider, if I move 300 miles west, I have Portugal, if I move 300 miles north, I have our delightful neighbours, the frenchies, if I look to the horizon in the northern coast, my eyes will reach the british coasts... maybe by the Wales part, where they speak not english, but gaelic, a beautiful ancient language from which derive many names of little towns and cities in the US...

In Madrid, Bilbao, Barcelona and other spanish cities, we have indicators in english, japanese, german, french... in the streets, in airports, metro stations, turistical places... non of those are oficial or cooficial languages in Spain.

A 15% of our population is composed of migrants from Africa, Eastern Europe, Laitn America, China, India... walking in the streets you can hear quechua, cantonese, english, french, arabic, russian, romanian... and, of course, all the accents and forms of spanish.

We do not feel our languages menaced.

I think the issue is maybe that hispanic culture is strong enough to not being submerged or assimilated into english in the US. And this is the first time that such a thing happens. Italians, germans, polish, jewish, russians... all the other european migrants that came before to the US loosed their language by the second generation.

The fact that this will not happen with latin american and their spanish is new to you, and maybe taking a look to the old Europe could be helpful. I think spanish will become a part of US culture and a powerful tool for communication, commerce and convivence. In the end, the US have had always, since the begining, a spanish soul.

The best way to protect a culture, a language, is opening it. That's why english language has become such a powerful tool for all. In many ways, english is not only your language, but an universal one.

Since someone attemps to preserve it or to keep it free of contamination, english will not be anymore an universal cultural tool, and its  preeminence will be lost, just like happenned to latin, german, french... they just remain as vehicular languages in some specific areas but, before, they where universal tools of culture, sciencie, business... just as is english now.

Just thing for a while what will happen with US economy if we, the 5.200 million people that do not have english as a mother tongue decide to switch off the english language option. English is a magnificent tool, but don't forget that we are very generous to you using it.

Saludos,

:-)
love is blindness...  a wonderful song!

Offline BT65

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #24 on: April 28, 2007, 10:00:01 PM »
Well said, alberche.  Where I'm at, when you look at the job postings, it always says "bilingual preferred" (and they're talking about Spanish).
I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

Offline xyahka

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #25 on: April 28, 2007, 11:59:48 PM »
Well it is time for a latin to say something...

first i know why those messages bother you... because you are a square minded intolerant.

Funny that an hiv poz who knows what is to be discriminated is still able to discriminate others.... looks like someone has not learnt that much after all....

Perhaps you should take a look at your own experience and see how it feels to find no help, none to talk to, that might open a whole new world for you.  If spanish options are offered is not your business!! Those options are for me, not for you. You stick to the single language you know and let us live in peace.

Plus let me tell you that most of the "anglo" people there are not purely americans, remember aborigens were the owner of that land before your white ass arrived. They are the real americans. Don't feel so proud of yourself, you are in fact a descendent of inmigrants too. And English was not the original language anyways.... so? why do you complain if you are not able to look at your story and see things as they really are.

And if one day a latin person discriminate you for being poz.... then don't complain you both will be just the same.

Y si te molesta el español, que pena... a mi no me importa :) aprende a respetar a los otros para que alguien encuentre una razón de respetarte.
13/03/07 1er diagnóstico /Peso: 79kg
19/04/07 CD4: 494 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 80kg
19/07/07 CD4: 659 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79.5kg
06/03/08 CD4: 573 (después de meses muy deprimido) /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79kg
17/09/08 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 84Kg
06/02/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 85Kg /HCV: Neg /HBV: Neg.
07/03/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg / Gym 3días/semana y Natación 2días/semana.
12/05/09 CD4: 470 /Cviral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg.
08/07/09 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 77Kg.
09/12/09 CD4: 510 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg. No medicinas aún
10/01/10 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
15/05/10 CD4: 320 /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
01/02/11 CD4: 291 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
05/05/11 CD4: 366 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
27/07/11 CD4: 255 /CViral: 138000 /Peso: 78kg.

Disfrutando y aceptando una nueva vida...

Offline puertorico2006

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #26 on: April 29, 2007, 03:37:48 AM »
no entiendo cual es el problema con un boton que dice "english" o español...te tarda 1 segundo a escuchar esas opciones y otra segundo a apretar el boton....No entiendo el racismo porque todos somos humanos lo unico que cambia es el idioma y la ubicacion geografica.....

A mi tampoco me importa que te molesta porque eres un poco ignorante y cerrado de mente....pero igual espero que cambias tu punto de vista eventualmente y te deseo buenas cosas en esta vida  :-* ;D

-josh
(who wishes he knew a 3rd language)
Infected Probably: may 2005
Diagnosed: 11/2006

11/28/2006 CD4:309 / VL: 1907 No meds yet
12/27/2006 CD4:339/  VL:1649 No meds yet
  4/28/2007 CD4:550/  VL:1800 No meds :-)

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #27 on: April 29, 2007, 10:35:43 AM »
XY, you are absolutely entitled to your opinions, but you are not entitled to start flaming with name calling like "square minded intolerant."

Believe me, I appreciate your feelings about this issue, but the flaming has to stop right now.

                                                             ................

Jeff, I've been watching this thread carefully because from the moment you began it I thought it was very possibly going to become explosive.

I suspect you really know it now or knew that when you wrote this:

  "I dont want to sound cold or prejudiced (which I guess I am to some degree), but I have a problem with this....Im not exactly sure why, who knows maybe it is prejudice, but I just wish everyone would speak English which is the official language in the US as far as I know."

What you have expressed is really a classic prejudiced viewpoint by someone who knows it is just that, also "knows better" and who nevertheless wants to find a socially acceptable way of having that prejudiced opinion hold sway.

Dealing with prejudice is one of the most challenging problems we live with and it is incumbent upon each of us to find ways to resolve it peacefully and creatively in our daily lives. You have a choice. You can continue to  nurse your resentment OR you can take a fresh look at what's going on within you about this issue you've raised.

From my experience that means ultimately letting go of the "us" and "them" attitude and accepting we're all a part of "us."   

Lastly, I ask you to please not defend yourself. That will only maintain the status quo. I urge you to take a few breaths and just consider what people have said.

All in all there's been remarkable forbearance shown to you about this subject so I am asking the same of you.

Cheers,
« Last Edit: April 29, 2007, 10:43:23 AM by Andy Velez »
Andy Velez

Offline J.R.E.

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #28 on: April 29, 2007, 10:47:45 AM »
Well it is time for a latin to say something...

Funny that an hiv poz who knows what is to be discriminated is still able to discriminate others.... looks like someone has not learnt that much after all....




Jeff in NYC is NOT HIV positive. We need to clear that up .


Ray
Current Meds ; Viramune, Epzicom, 40mg of simvastatin, 12.5mg of Hydrochlorothiazide.
Metoprolol tartrate 25mg



http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=40802.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=45159.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=39722.msg495621;topicseen#msg495621

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=46806.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=39414.msg491701#msg491701


 In October of 2003, My t-cell count was 16, Viral load was over 500,000, Percentage at that time was 5%. I started my first  HAART regimen  on October 24th,03.

 As of 6/4/14,  t-cells are at 423, Viral load <40

 Current % is at 13% 

  
 62 years young.

Offline Sdgirl

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #29 on: April 29, 2007, 11:27:13 AM »
Wait a second.....................Jeff IS NOT HIV positive????  I'm confused? 
 
"Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate.  Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure.  It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us.  We ask ourselves.."Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous?  Actually, who are you not to be?"

Offline xyahka

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  • Dance together!! aha!! aha!! I like it!!
Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #30 on: April 29, 2007, 11:36:15 AM »
Andy, i didn't want to flame him by calling him "square minded intolerant" i said it in a latino friendly way :) ....i swear it!

Other thing,... is he is not positive, i don't really care, the point is.. if he is here for longer than me... he should have learnt something... shouldn't he?

Cuidense, les envio un abrazo, me voy a la playa!!!!
13/03/07 1er diagnóstico /Peso: 79kg
19/04/07 CD4: 494 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 80kg
19/07/07 CD4: 659 /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79.5kg
06/03/08 CD4: 573 (después de meses muy deprimido) /CViral: ?? /Peso: 79kg
17/09/08 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 84Kg
06/02/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 85Kg /HCV: Neg /HBV: Neg.
07/03/09 CD4: ?? /CViral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg / Gym 3días/semana y Natación 2días/semana.
12/05/09 CD4: 470 /Cviral: ?? /Peso: 87Kg.
08/07/09 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 77Kg.
09/12/09 CD4: 510 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg. No medicinas aún
10/01/10 CD4: ? /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
15/05/10 CD4: 320 /CViral: ? /Peso: 76Kg.
01/02/11 CD4: 291 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
05/05/11 CD4: 366 /CViral: ? /Peso: 78kg.
27/07/11 CD4: 255 /CViral: 138000 /Peso: 78kg.

Disfrutando y aceptando una nueva vida...

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #31 on: April 29, 2007, 12:34:41 PM »
XY, thanks for the hugs, papi.

I wish I was headed to the beach today too. I'll go with some sunshine here in NYC.

Cheers,
Andy Velez

Offline Queen Tokelove

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #32 on: April 29, 2007, 03:46:25 PM »
Actually, hearing the spanish version does not bother me. To be honest, I am kinda jealous of those who understand spanish. I am half Puerto Rican and can only remember the spanish I was taught in school. When I went to Puerto Rico some years back, I was in heaven and very anxious to learn spanish. Once I started learning it, cause I was there 3 different times for about 3 months each time, I lost it when I came back home because there was no one to speak to.
Started Atripla/Ziagen on 9/13/07.
10/31/07 CD4-265 VL- undetectable
2/6/08 CD4- 401 VL- undetectable
5/7/08 CD4- 705 VL- undetectable
6/4/08 CD4- 775 VL- undetectable
8/6/08 CD4- 805 VL- undetectable
11/13/08 CD4- 774 VL--undetectable
2/4/09  CD4- 484  VL- 18,000 (2 months off meds)
3/3/09---Starting Back on Meds---
4/27/09 CD4- 664 VL-- undetectable
6/17/09 CD4- 438 VL- 439
8/09 CD4- 404 VL- 1,600
01-22-10-- CD4- 525 VL- 59,000
Cherish the simple things life has to offer

The Royal Blog

Offline sdcabincrew74

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #33 on: April 30, 2007, 03:31:53 PM »
If it bothers you so much, learn the language then you will understand it.   This whole english only sh1t has got to go!  Besides you are in NYC a HUGE tourist destination you must cater to those travel dollars. 
The difference between an overnight and a layover is luck!

Offline aupointillimite

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #34 on: April 30, 2007, 07:37:04 PM »
I went to an exhibit at the Virginia Historical Society yesterday... it was on Jamestown, Santa Fe, and Quebec... and was all about the colonization of North America in the 17th century.  The entire thing was in English, Spanish, and French... and one part of it was about the interaction between the three cultures.  This mixing has been going on for four hundred years, and I see no evidence of it stopping now.

Personally, I like it. 
Your tastebuds can't repel flavor of this magnitude!

Offline aupointillimite

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #35 on: April 30, 2007, 07:45:48 PM »
Oh, and I can't see where it's been mentioned in so many words here... but the United States doesn't have an official language.

That thing about it almost being German is a myth, but yeah... we don't have one.

Hawaii has English and Hawaiian as the official languages.

There are some states that have English as the official state language.  Florida is one.  California is another.  Texas isn't.  Weird. 
Your tastebuds can't repel flavor of this magnitude!

Offline AlanBama

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #36 on: April 30, 2007, 08:15:36 PM »
I'm with Queen, I get envious because I only know English...

and fried, I did take french in high school - 3 years of it.   My poor French teacher, Mme. Bedell, was constantly saying "Alain, Alain, Alain, you must speak faster!"

Par-ley Vous Y'all ??
« Last Edit: April 30, 2007, 08:17:45 PM by AlanBama »
"Remember my sentimental friend that a heart is not judged by how much you love, but by how much you are loved by others." - The Wizard of Oz

Offline aztecan

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #37 on: April 30, 2007, 10:14:36 PM »
My dear grandmother spoke seven languages. She was from Central Europe, from an area that was then part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire under the rule of the Hapsburgs.

The seventh and last language she learned was English after she emigrated to the U.S. She had a delightful accent. She also refused to teach me any of the languages she spoke, although I managed to pick up a few words of Polish and Slovakian. (Very few).

I regret this to this day. What I wouldn't give to be multilingual. As it is, I can get by in Spanish, although those who hear me speak it say I speak like a Cuban.  ???

I live in the state that was and, I think, still is the only officially bilingual state in the union. Here, all legal documents and published legal announcements must be in English and Spanish. Its been that way for decades.

Our differences make us more versatile, more adaptable and have been one of the strengths of this nation.

Oh, by the way, I hate telephone messaging systems period.

HUGS,

Mark
"May your life preach more loudly than your lips."
~ William Ellery Channing (Unitarian Minister)

Offline blondbeauty

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #38 on: May 01, 2007, 09:11:21 AM »
In Spain we don´t have the English option.
The only member in these forums approved by WINBA: World International Nail and Beauty Association.
Epstein Barr +; CMV +; Toxoplasmosis +; HIV-1 +.
Counts when starting treatment:
V.L.:80.200 copies. CD4: 25%=503
Started Sustiva-Truvada 14/August/2006
Last V.L.count (Oct 2013): Undetectable
Last CD4 count (OCT 2013): 52%= 933

Offline TheKurgan

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #39 on: May 02, 2007, 11:04:44 PM »
The liberals are mostly disillusioned college students who know precisely jack and shit about the real world (and Jack left town), or politicians trying to make all the illegals legal so they can get more votes.

Now I for one, refuse to learn Spanish, because I would not move to a Spanish speaking country, attach myself like a barnacle to their social welfare programs, and then demand that they all learn English.

I do speak some Spanish, but I just ignore them until they speak English to me.

Offline thunter34

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #40 on: May 02, 2007, 11:05:52 PM »
Hola, Ryan.

How do I say this?

Tu eres no caliente!
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline TheKurgan

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #41 on: May 02, 2007, 11:12:55 PM »
Hola, Ryan.

How do I say this?

Tu eres no caliente!

Ladies and gentlemen, let me present a probable likeness of Thunter34:


Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #42 on: May 02, 2007, 11:14:03 PM »
The liberals are mostly disillusioned college students who know precisely jack and shit about the real world (and Jack left town), or politicians trying to make all the illegals legal so they can get more votes.

Now I for one, refuse to learn Spanish, because I would not move to a Spanish speaking country, attach myself like a barnacle to their social welfare programs, and then demand that they all learn English.

I do speak some Spanish, but I just ignore them until they speak English to me.

Pray tell, how much of the world can a 23 year old Walmart worker in Huntington, IN really know?
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline JeffInNYC

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #43 on: May 02, 2007, 11:14:23 PM »
Ladies and gentlemen, let me present a probable likeness of Thunter34:



How do you say "pleasingly plump" en español?

Offline milker

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #44 on: May 02, 2007, 11:15:07 PM »
sigh
mid-dec: stupid ass
mid-jan: seroconversion
mid-feb: poz
mar 07: cd4 432 (35%) vl 54000
may 07: cd4 399 (28%) vl 27760
jul 07: cd4 403 (26%) vl 99241
oct 07: cd4 353 (24%) vl 29993
jan 08: cd4 332 (26%) vl 33308
mar 08: cd4 392 (23%) vl 75548
jun 08: cd4 325 (27%) vl 45880
oct 08: cd4 197 (20%) vl 154000 <== aids diagnosis
nov 2 08 start Atripla
nov 30 08: cd4 478 (23%) vl 1880 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
feb 19 09: cd4 398 (24%) vl 430 getting there!
apr 23 09: cd4 604 (29%) vl 50 woohoo :D :D
jul 30 09: cd4 512 (29%) vl undetectable :D :D
may 27 10: cd4 655 (32%) vl undetectable :D :D

Now accepting applications from blowjob ninjas™

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #45 on: May 02, 2007, 11:15:18 PM »
English which is the official language in the US as far as I know.

incorrect
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline TheKurgan

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #46 on: May 02, 2007, 11:22:22 PM »
Pray tell, how much of the world can a 23 year old Walmart worker in Huntington, IN really know?

I've been quite a few things, and Wal-Mart is really kind of like a backup job right now while I'm in school, my boss called me and asked me to come in today at like 8 AM, and I just said "Fuck Wal-Mart" and hung up, honestly I don't give a shit if they fire me, the job means next to nothing to me, and it's just something I'm soldiering through for a few more weeks.

Now, as for the 23 year old part, I guess you consider being racist something really, truly awful, but have no problem discriminating over age, hypocritical, but oh well, what can you expect from old people?

I've been living on my own for over 7 years, in that time I've lived in three states and 5 cities, I lived in Indianapolis and Muncie, Indiana for a couple of years, I lived in Dayton, Ohio, Ann Arbor, Michigan.

For the most part, what I've seen of most minorities, they fit their stereotypes pretty well, I've seen blacks and mexicans out in the street shooting each other, mugging people, etc, most of them don't even have a desire to better themselves even if they do have the ability.

Offline TheKurgan

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #47 on: May 02, 2007, 11:24:01 PM »
incorrect

Technically there is no official language in the US, so I suppose we're all supposed to learn 100+ languages so that no matter who falls off the banana boat, we can accommodate them.

Offline milker

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #48 on: May 02, 2007, 11:24:21 PM »
I've been quite a few things, and Wal-Mart is really kind of like a backup job right now while I'm in school, my boss called me and asked me to come in today at like 8 AM, and I just said "Fuck Wal-Mart" and hung up, honestly I don't give a shit if they fire me, the job means next to nothing to me, and it's just something I'm soldiering through for a few more weeks.

Now, as for the 23 year old part, I guess you consider being racist something really, truly awful, but have no problem discriminating over age, hypocritical, but oh well, what can you expect from old people?

I've been living on my own for over 7 years, in that time I've lived in three states and 5 cities, I lived in Indianapolis and Muncie, Indiana for a couple of years, I lived in Dayton, Ohio, Ann Arbor, Michigan.

For the most part, what I've seen of most minorities, they fit their stereotypes pretty well, I've seen blacks and mexicans out in the street shooting each other, mugging people, etc, most of them don't even have a desire to better themselves even if they do have the ability.

 :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(  :'(

So touching. I had to buy more Kleenex.

Milker.
mid-dec: stupid ass
mid-jan: seroconversion
mid-feb: poz
mar 07: cd4 432 (35%) vl 54000
may 07: cd4 399 (28%) vl 27760
jul 07: cd4 403 (26%) vl 99241
oct 07: cd4 353 (24%) vl 29993
jan 08: cd4 332 (26%) vl 33308
mar 08: cd4 392 (23%) vl 75548
jun 08: cd4 325 (27%) vl 45880
oct 08: cd4 197 (20%) vl 154000 <== aids diagnosis
nov 2 08 start Atripla
nov 30 08: cd4 478 (23%) vl 1880 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
feb 19 09: cd4 398 (24%) vl 430 getting there!
apr 23 09: cd4 604 (29%) vl 50 woohoo :D :D
jul 30 09: cd4 512 (29%) vl undetectable :D :D
may 27 10: cd4 655 (32%) vl undetectable :D :D

Now accepting applications from blowjob ninjas™

Offline Dachshund

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Re: For English, press one - para español, marque el dos
« Reply #49 on: May 02, 2007, 11:24:30 PM »
You have also been banned and will be again.

 


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