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Author Topic: How much HIV is enough?  (Read 4162 times)

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Offline bimjhb2

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  • Posts: 7
How much HIV is enough?
« on: February 04, 2008, 04:23:01 PM »
I've done a lot of reading on the topic and I am amazed at how many doom and gloom people are out there. I recently had my first encounter with a guy, in which he gave me a bj, and i came in his mouth, and i have him a very 'light' bj; by that I mean I licked the side of his penis, put the tip of his penis in my mouth a few times, probably tasted pre-cum with my tongue; I never actaully sucked so the amount of precum i was exposed to was superficial at most; but he never ejaculated (not even once during the whole episode)
My oral giving lasted maybe 2 minutes.
Also: He claimed to have been tested in December, and was STD(neg) - I dont know him so he may be lying - who knows!

Now you read on the forums and you get guys posting how they got hiv from this exact method of exposure: I say they are not admitting to some more risky behaviour.
The way I understand it, you have to 1) get a load of cum in your mouth, 2) have a path for the virus to get into your bloodstream 3) have a nice hospitable environment for the virus to remain alive to infect.
Even if you had a superficial cut in your mouth, the virus still needs to get into your bloodstream. Lets not forget saliva stops aids too so perhaps you need a dry mouth to help it along.

There are so many forums and articles which cite that you cant get it - and then there are some who say you certainly can, up to 6.6%. Thats more risky than getting it via anal sex!

So heres what I want from this forum: Who has honestly got hiv from oral only exposure as I describe. I am going to bet none and if there are some people, can they honestly say they NEVER engaged in any risky activity, not even a quick bit of unprotected anal (for 5 seconds)

Also, from what I have ready, the Viral Load in pre-cum is seriously low, well no one knows but it's a heck of a lot lower than semen - anyone know what the VL is in precum??

Any experts out there, did I get any of this wrong?

However, what I do notice is that everyone is so obcessed with HIV they forget about the array of other stds you can get. My rule from now on is:
NO SEXUAL EXPOSURE without a condom, not even giving or receiving a BJ!

Oh yes, and I will probably go for a test in about 3 months just to make sure I am STD free but I am going to stop reading these forums because I think my main worry, is the fact that the doom and gloomers are actaully making me worry sick!

Cheers
« Last Edit: February 04, 2008, 04:26:36 PM by bimjhb2 »

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Risks of getting HIV from giving oral to a man
« Reply #1 on: February 04, 2008, 06:31:23 PM »
Anytime you have sex with anyone you are potentially at risk. Theoretically.

BUT in the real world of HIV we know that basically the risks are unprotected vaginal and anal intercourse. As long as you consistently use latex condoms everytime you have intercourse we consider that sufficient protection against sexual transmission of HIV.

As far as receiving a blowjob, there's never been a single documented case of transmmission in that manner. Not one. As far as giving oral to another guy, there have been some anecdotal reports of HIV transmission in that manner -- not a lot of them I might add considering how common an activity it is -- but they are not well documented. Various factors seem to come into play which affect the ability to get solid, credible information.

On the other hand we do have longterm studies of sero-discordant couples, both straight and gay, who have had only protected intercourse and lots of unprotected and mutual oral. The results have been that not a single sero-negative partner has become infected. It's important to note that our saliva has several elements which serve as very effective inhibitors to HIV transmission.

There are certain cautions to consider. Risk maybe higher if ejaculation takes place orally. Or if the person giving oral  has poor oral care or a recent wound in their mouth.

Yet still for many the fear and doubt exists about giving oral. What it comes down to finally is what is what level of risk you are prepared to accept.

We suggest that anyone who's sexually active ought to have a full STD panel done regularly. That means at least annually and depending on how active, every six months is even better. Other STDs are much easier to acquire than HIV.

Beyond that, it's your choice as to what is acceptable risk to you.   
Andy Velez

Offline bimjhb2

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  • Posts: 7
Re: Risks of getting HIV from giving oral to a man
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2008, 04:20:19 PM »
Hmm - 88 views and still no one has posted an HIV+ status as described in my post...
I do see some posters like keyite who claim they got infected by Oral only, but also mention they did have protected anal sex, and unprotected anal sex a while back... i cant help but wonder, do they even take these risks into consideration at all?
I have seen one post where someone claims to have got HIV from just oral, no ejaculate and no anal - is that no anal ever or no anal from their encounter.!?



Offline Matty the Damned

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Re: Risks of getting HIV from giving oral to a man
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2008, 04:28:28 PM »
Hmm - 88 views and still no one has posted an HIV+ status as described in my post...

 ::)

I do see some posters like keyite who claim they got infected by Oral only, but also mention they did have protected anal sex, and unprotected anal sex a while back... i cant help but wonder, do they even take these risks into consideration at all?
I have seen one post where someone claims to have got HIV from just oral, no ejaculate and no anal - is that no anal ever or no anal from their encounter.!?


And I know a guy who lives under the bridge near the Railway station in my town who claims he's Jesus. I'm pretty sure he's mixed up on that point. I'm thinking Jesus would wash more often.

Just because some "claims" or "reports" something doesn't make it true. Just because an HIV positive person makes the claim doesn't necessarily give it any particular legitimacy. Just because it's posted in one of our Poz Only forums doesn't make it HIV gospel.

The answers we give here in AMI are based on peer-reviewed science as reflected in the Lessons section here at AIDSmeds. There are no scientifically documented cases of HIV being transmitted through unprotected oral sex (in either direction) and that's what we report.

Now if you choose to go snooping around in the poz-only forums and you freak yourself out or end up confused, that's your lookout. You certainly shouldn't be dragging that stuff back here into AMI.

MtD

Offline bimjhb2

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  • Posts: 7
Re: Risks of getting HIV from giving oral to a man
« Reply #4 on: February 05, 2008, 04:54:37 PM »
I agree :-) My whole point is that there are so many doomers and gloomers; and unrefuted claims, it really makes me mad

Offline Ann

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    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: Risks of getting HIV from giving oral to a man
« Reply #5 on: February 07, 2008, 08:54:00 AM »
bim,

I need you to read this thread and the Welcome Thread and start abiding by the rules of these forums. Not only have you been pestering people via PM, but you've posted in other threads in this forum and you've also broken one of the cardinal rules of this place - posting in the forums meant for hiv positive people ONLY.

The ONLY place you should post in these forums is in THIS thread. Do NOT use the PMs to question positive people about their infection. It's damned rude. If you keep running amok, you'll be banned. It's as simple as that. 

Thank you for your cooperation.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline bimjhb2

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  • Posts: 7
Re: Risks of getting HIV from giving oral to a man
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2008, 02:33:50 PM »
Experts: A question about infection.
What is the time frame of infection - e.g. I have sex with someone, I catch the HIV virus. How long does it take before I become infectious in my semen? Is this the 2 week window you talk about, the seroconversion thing?

Offline Ann

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  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: Risks of getting HIV from giving oral to a man
« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2008, 06:33:36 PM »
bim,

The "seroconversion thing" we talk about has to do with the production of antibodies, not the virus itself. A newly infected person can become infectious within days.

Use condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse and you won't have to worry about it. Seriously.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline bimjhb2

  • Member
  • Posts: 7
How much HIV is enough?
« Reply #8 on: February 10, 2008, 04:37:26 PM »
New question: I have read in a few articles that you need to be exposed a few times, or atleast, you need a lot of exposure to HIV. Take for example my case: I had one encounter whereby I gave blowjob for a few minutes; no ejaculation took place, possibly was precum (I dont know) but it would have been a low amount of precum; no obvious cuts, wounds, ulcers etc in my mouth;

 Now in some articles, they say it's quality and quantity; what I dont get it the bit about quantity. Take sex for instance, if you have vaginal sex and 1 sperm gets to the egg, you can fall pregnant; whereas, if you have exposure to 1 hiv virus, it's not enough to infect you? Do any of the experts have a good explanation for this? In my case, I understand my risk was almost non-existant, but I am still curious as to the mechanics behind infection...

Offline thunter34

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  • Posts: 7,302
  • His name is Carl.
Re: How much HIV is enough?
« Reply #9 on: February 10, 2008, 04:56:18 PM »
if you have exposure to 1 hiv virus, it's not enough to infect you? Do any of the experts have a good explanation for this?

Yes, the explanation is that you've been reading too many bullshit articles about HIV on the web.
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline Matty the Damned

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  • Posts: 12,198
  • Ninja Please
Re: How much HIV is enough?
« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2008, 05:00:18 PM »
Honey,

Bullshit indeed.

The questions you're asking are really outside the bailiwick of the of AMI forum. In this forum we provide advice to people regarding particular risks they've had (or think they've had) based on sound peer reviewed science.

We've done this for you.

Your more general questions about the mechanics of HIV infection and HIV science at large may well be better accommodated elsewhere. To that end, I've checked our links page and found an outfit who might be able to assist you with this. You might wish to try asking an expert at  the HIV InSite operation.

MtD

Online anniebc

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  • Posts: 5,933
  • AM member since 2003
Re: How much HIV is enough?
« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2008, 06:28:31 PM »
I have merged your thread..please keep all your thoughts and question in this thread from now on...thanks for your cooperation.

Jan
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