Author Topic: ok spinoff of the positive thread-- whats the skinny on bb with other pos? (Read 9349 times)

surf18 · « **on:** February 18, 2011, 03:28:05 pm »

i for one am scared to death of it but i m open to hearing others opinions.

Cliff · « **Reply #1 on:** February 18, 2011, 03:43:07 pm »

You're right to be scared to death. You could get AIDS. Again.

Ann · « **Reply #2 on:** February 18, 2011, 03:47:24 pm »

BB with other poz people doesn't scare me in the slightest. The whole reinfection thing is a load of bollocks - it's as rare as hen's teeth if it ever actually happens at all. My poz partner and I never use condoms. I might consider using condoms with a poz if it were a one night stand with someone I didn't really know, but that's because I don't want gonorrhea or syphilis or whatever, not because I'm afraid of reinfection.

Hellraiser · « **Reply #3 on:** February 18, 2011, 03:48:30 pm »

Quote from: surf18 on February 18, 2011, 03:28:05 pm

i for one am scared to death of it but i m open to hearing others opinions.

There are a couple of pretty lengthy threads on this very topic in these forums. The general concensus is that getting a "Superinfection" is probably out of the cards (at least for those of us on meds). There are plenty of opportunities to get other complicating infections. Herpes, Hepatitis C, Syphilis, Gonorrhea, Chlamydia, or HPV. I am of the opinion that I won't bareback outside of a relationship, but if I were dating another poz guy I might assuming I trusted that he wasn't opening himself up to new infections and we had a very open and honest discussion about our sexual histories. Doesn't that sound like fun?

drewm · « **Reply #4 on:** February 18, 2011, 03:49:05 pm »

Quote from: Cliff on February 18, 2011, 03:43:07 pm

You're right to be scared to death. You could get AIDS. Again.

Cliff has a point. My doc told me to quit taking loads because other variations in HIV could create a change in my bug and now that we're fighting this one with success, we don't want to be fighting something potentially worse. That's really my take on it.

surf18 · « **Reply #5 on:** February 18, 2011, 03:50:38 pm »

interesting points. my Dr never really answered me , he cant obviously go out and say do it. interesting.

drewm · « **Reply #6 on:** February 18, 2011, 03:51:28 pm »

Quote from: Ann on February 18, 2011, 03:47:24 pm

BB with other poz people doesn't scare me in the slightest. The whole reinfection thing is a load of bollocks - it's as rare as hen's teeth if it ever actually happens at all. My poz partner and I never use condoms. I might consider using condoms with a poz if it were a one night stand with someone I didn't really know, but that's because I don't want gonorrhea or syphilis or whatever, not because I'm afraid of reinfection.

I may need to re-visit this. I sure want to

Buckmark · « **Reply #7 on:** February 18, 2011, 03:52:25 pm »

Quote from: Hellraiser on February 18, 2011, 03:48:30 pm

I am of the opinion that I won't bareback outside of a relationship, but if I were dating another poz guy I might assuming I trusted that he wasn't opening himself up to new infections and we had a very open and honest discussion about our sexual histories. Doesn't that sound like fun?

It certainly removes the spontaneity from sex.

Hellraiser · « **Reply #8 on:** February 18, 2011, 03:52:33 pm »

Quote from: drewm on February 18, 2011, 03:49:05 pm

Cliff has a point. My doc told me to quit taking loads because other variations in HIV could create a change in my bug and now that we're fighting this one with success, we don't want to be fighting something potentially worse. That's really my take on it.

This is the aforementioned Superinfection.

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=31877.0

Cliff · « **Reply #9 on:** February 18, 2011, 03:55:06 pm »

Sorry, I was being silly. I don't really have a point.

I don't think reinfection is of serious concern. Either it's rare or if it's not so rare, it's of little consequence to disease progression.

woodshere · « **Reply #10 on:** February 18, 2011, 03:58:27 pm »

I view it as purely economical, saves money by not having to purchase condoms!

mecch · « **Reply #11 on:** February 18, 2011, 04:01:42 pm »

Oh Mary, can't you get free condoms anywhere?

Dachshund · « **Reply #12 on:** February 18, 2011, 04:05:57 pm »

Think of the upside. Just think how super positive we would all feel if we had the blessing of a super infection.

surf18 · « **Reply #13 on:** February 18, 2011, 04:12:34 pm »

ok so hypothetically say it does exist this superinfection. so say a neg partner catches it from his pos partner. has high viral load in beginning pre meds and they have unprotected sex. could the once neg now infected by the bottom guy give said bottom guy a superinfection even if the virus was passed on to the top from the bottom?wow this shit is confusing. i think ill just use rubbers till the cure comes.

skeebo1969 · « **Reply #14 on:** February 18, 2011, 04:13:56 pm »

Quote from: surf18 on February 18, 2011, 03:28:05 pm

i for one am scared to death of it but i m open to hearing others opinions.

In my opinion it's kind of like Santa Claus....

gets a bunch of credit but never delivers.

Hellraiser · « **Reply #15 on:** February 18, 2011, 04:19:16 pm »

Quote from: surf18 on February 18, 2011, 04:12:34 pm

ok so hypothetically say it does exist this superinfection. so say a neg partner catches it from his pos partner. has high viral load in beginning pre meds and they have unprotected sex. could the once neg now infected by the bottom guy give said bottom guy a superinfection even if the virus was passed on to the top from the bottom?wow this shit is confusing. i think ill just use rubbers till the cure comes.

If partner A infects partner B, then partner B "Reinfects" partner A with the virus it would be the same exact strain. Resistance to meds doesn't develop in the absence of meds.

David_CA · « **Reply #16 on:** February 18, 2011, 04:59:51 pm »

Quote from: skeebo1969 on February 18, 2011, 04:13:56 pm

In my opinion it's kind of like Santa Claus....

gets a bunch of credit but never delivers.

That's pretty much my opinion, too.

Seriously, I've never met (in person) / had sex with another positive guy that wanted to use, or actually used, condoms. I honestly feel 'safer' having sex with a guy who knows he's HIV+. Most positive guys that I'm acquainted with have regular Dr. visits, VL tests, general STD tests, etc. Most negative guys that I know aren't as conscious of their sexual health. My experiences have given me no reason to change, either.

surf18 · « **Reply #17 on:** February 18, 2011, 05:11:28 pm »

So those that bareback are also taking loads then too. Not just doing the pullout?
I don't know if this is apprioate but it would be hot

skeebo1969 · « **Reply #18 on:** February 18, 2011, 05:15:47 pm »

Quote from: surf18 on February 18, 2011, 05:11:28 pm

So those that bareback are also taking loads then too. Not just doing the pullout?
I don't know if this is apprioate but it would be hot

Sometimes I even pull out and shoot it in my wife's eyes....

drewm · « **Reply #19 on:** February 18, 2011, 05:38:56 pm »

I was/am a bottom who takes/took loads. Not in the frequency I used to.

MarcoPoz · « **Reply #20 on:** February 18, 2011, 05:50:43 pm »

I look at it this way: Good sex should involve communication--and some of that communication can be verbal using actual words

If I were to be with another poz person and we decided that we wanted to not use condoms, I'd want to know a few things to help me feel more comfortable about my decision:

1) Do they have an STD they could pass to me?
2) Do I have an STD I could pass to them?
3) Do they take their meds and have a low viral load--no apparent resistance to their meds?
4) Do I take my meds and do I have a low viral load--no apparent resistance to my meds?

If 1 and 2 are no and 3 and 4 are yes--Then rumble, young man rumble!!!!!

bmancanfly · « **Reply #21 on:** February 18, 2011, 05:51:58 pm »

I've been with my partner for 6 yrs (both poz) we've never used a condom.

Hey, that's one positive thing about being poz - I finally thought of one.

richie · « **Reply #22 on:** February 18, 2011, 08:01:03 pm »

Quote from: surf18 on February 18, 2011, 03:28:05 pm

i for one am scared to death of it but i m open to hearing others opinions.

Ugh. Since no one has mentioned this that I could tell, I will. If I were to have condomless intercourse with another pozzie, what would happen if they were unsurpressed and had a previously developed resistance to my current regimen? I would take a load containing a virus that could easily defeat my meds (i.e., my meds wouldn't have any affect and the virus would replicate easily). That would, in some terms, advance my disease as I'd need to change a regimen, assuming I even could. The risk of that is probably as low as getting HIV in the first place. Just my luck....

Hellraiser · « **Reply #23 on:** February 18, 2011, 08:17:23 pm »

Quote from: richie on February 18, 2011, 08:01:03 pm

Ugh. Since no one has mentioned this that I could tell, I will. If I were to have condomless intercourse with another pozzie, what would happen if they were unsurpressed and had a previously developed resistance to my current regimen? I would take a load containing a virus that could easily defeat my meds (i.e., my meds wouldn't have any affect and the virus would replicate easily). That would, in some terms, advance my disease as I'd need to change a regimen, assuming I even could. The risk of that is probably as low as getting HIV in the first place. Just my luck....

The person would need to hypothetically...

1) have a resistance to your meds
2) have a detectable viral load
3) expose you to his virus

leatherman · « **Reply #24 on:** February 18, 2011, 08:21:30 pm »

Quote from: richie on February 18, 2011, 08:01:03 pm

If I were to have condomless intercourse with another pozzie, what would happen if they were unsurpressed and had a previously developed resistance to my current regimen?

if you look at another thread (Re-infection! http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=32981) in which we discussed this issue this past summer, you'll see that the few "studies/reports" about this issue showed that the only time reinfection/superinfection happened was when both of the partners did NOT have a surpressed viral load. There have been no reports to show that two partners, both with supressed viral loads, re-infected one another or super-infected one another.

theoretically, it seems that if your meds are working properly and keeping your viral load suppressed, and you were exposed to a viral load, your meds should tackle the small amount of incoming virus - just as it did to the virus that was initally in your body. If that virus has resistance (and usually resistance happens to one or two types of meds, rarely if ever to a whole HAART regimen), your meds should again tackle the small amount of incoming virus with the types of meds that were still viable.

newt · « **Reply #25 on:** February 18, 2011, 08:24:45 pm »

There are limits on how boring life can be, and with the right man, yer, this is the deal. Gotta be the right man tho, and not skinny in the BB tackle dept. :-)

People go on about reinfection like is was important, but never so much about leukaemia. Which happens more often I wonder, combo or no combo? (answer: leukaemia).

- matt

leatherman · « **Reply #26 on:** February 18, 2011, 10:09:48 pm »

Quote from: newt on February 18, 2011, 08:24:45 pm

People go on about reinfection like is was important, but never so much about leukaemia. Which happens more often I wonder, combo or no combo? (answer: leukaemia)

except there's not much one can do to not get leukemia nor do risk factors guarantee leukemia
from webmd and other sources:

Quote

What causes leukemia?
Experts don't know what causes leukemia. But some things are known to increase the risk of some kinds of leukemia. These things are called risk factors.
...
But most people who have these risk factors don't get leukemia. And most people who get leukemia do not have any known risk factors.

so I would imagine that most people would not be very concerned about leukemia since there's nothing to be done to prevent it. However if re-infection is possible, and if it's happening frequently, if would be worth worrying about because there would be something one can do to avoid it - not do it bareback with a pozzie

so far it seems re-infection might actually happen some; but it has only happened to those who have unsuppressed viral loads AND who do it bareback with other pozzies with unsuppressed viral loads. So unless you and/or your partners have unsuppressed viral loads, worrying about reinfection is as useless as worrying about leukemia

tednlou2 · « **Reply #27 on:** February 19, 2011, 12:52:10 am »

I've read questions about this to these online docs at thebody and John Hopkins. About superinfection, I think they all say they don't think it really happens--except possibly soon after initial infection. Ok, book closed after learning from you guys here, studies, and those docs.

Then, those same docs will be asked about getting their partner's or a stranger's resistances to meds. Most of them will say they have seen it happen in their practices, but believe it is rare. So, they confuse us country-folk.

Inchlingblue · « **Reply #28 on:** February 19, 2011, 11:01:02 am »

As far as HIV I wouldn't be super concerned, especially if both are undetectable but the real issue with having unprotected sex (for me) has more to do with other STDs. Assuming we're talking unprotected sex with people one hardly knows (or with a cheating partner), I just really don't want to get Hep C especially or HPV or chlamydia or gonorrhea or herpes or . . . the list goes on.

Here's Dr. Gallant's take on the subject:

reinfection on medicines

Joel E. Gallant, M.D., M.P.H.

QUESTION Posted on Feb 3, 2011

I've heard from many people with HIv that they are still engaging ins equal activities with other HIV+ people without condoms...... Since HIV meds are used for prophylaxis; I was wondering if it would makes sense to say that someone already taking meds might be immune to re-infection?

On Feb 5, 2011 Joel E. Gallant, M.D., M.P.H. replied:

Someone on meds could be superinfected if exposed to a virus that was resistant to the drugs being taken. This may not be a common occurrence, but it can happen. The only time that condom-free sex should be considered is when BOTH partners have undetectable viral loads.

LINK:

http://www.hopkins-aids.edu/q_a/patient/recent_questions/reinfection_on_medicines.html?contentInstanceId=544425&siteId=7151

newt · « **Reply #29 on:** February 19, 2011, 08:26:19 pm »

Quote

Someone on meds could be superinfected if exposed to a virus that was resistant to the drugs being taken. This may not be a common occurrence, but it can happen. The only time that condom-free sex should be considered is when BOTH partners have undetectable viral loads.

Pretty much me benchmark, I need to know em well enough to be able to identify their mother/father/brother and read their lab sheets, but then woo hoo! bingo

- matt!

mikeyb39 · « **Reply #30 on:** February 22, 2011, 11:19:13 pm »

drewwm,

I just wanted to say i LOVE your honest responses. definitely made me laugh

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Author Topic: ok spinoff of the positive thread-- whats the skinny on bb with other pos? (Read 9349 times)