In another thread a tangential discussion about suicide being a selfish act surfaced. That may be true but it indicates to me some or many of the posters have no clue about the abject despair which drives most to think of suicide.\
LOL, Oh really... Just because we didn't announce our suicide attempts on a public forum or felt despair for simply being banned due to our own actions does not mean we don't know abject despair?
Now if you want to say you are of the opinion that suicide is not a sefless act, then just say so. That way I could disagree with you and leave it at that. I always thought of selfless as not taking others feelings into consideration. My wife and kids walking in the door finding my brains all over the back wall because I lost my fucking job due to health issues and feel utterly depressed for no known ryhme or reason is selfish in my book... just a messy, easy way out for me I guess.. leave it to them to piece together the answers and wonder what they could have done differently...
Now
C'mon Boo don't make this one of those right to die issues because it's really not....
In the same way, I would not have wanted to enter into a conversation on the wrongs or rights of suicide when you had your incident a couple of years ago, Boo, I don't think that today is necessarily the best of days to get into this subject.
Some may want to discuss the subject in the abstract, but for me anyway, when someone comes to this site seeking help for their reality, I think people's energies would be better spent offering support rather than engaging with this thread.
You reduce me to one night in 2007 and claim that as my sole familiarity with despair and hopelessness?
sadtom, I don't know or really care what your issue(s) is(are) with me but could we just get to the meat of things, as Liz Taylor brayed so often in WAOVW? instead of insulting me in your oh-so-imitable way? I mean, I love you, dude. But not in THAT way, just friends. I've defended you when idiots were braying about you as a parent or non-upstanding citizen or junkie or whatever the meaningless gossip/bs was about.
Excuse my pedantry but you're confusing "selfless" and "selfish" -- a selfless person would definitely consider the effect of his/her actions on others. A selfish person thinks only about himself. Selflessness doesn't apply unilaterally, if at all, to suicide in my humble opinion. Maybe a situation in which an "accidental" death would provide survivors with insurance or other benefits.
The suicide scenario you depict says more about you & your probable motives than about why people commit suicide. Shit, tom, I promised Charlotte if I ever used one of her guns I'd walk out to the 2nd floor balcony and stand facing the building to minimize the mess. Her dogs would clean the sidewalk on the ground in 10 minutes. I'm so anal-compulsive in 1999 I had Eudora email a message to Charlotte about 20 hours after I swallowed 400mg of klonopin (what a fucking dope! if only i shot up smack!). The dogs had to be walked, fed, and Cookie's glucose level measured, plus the cats. I woke up about an hour after the message was sent and immediately wrote another message claiming it was a bad joke... which it was since I woke up.
Sorry, skeebo, you really have no clue if all you can come up with is gory depictions of your own hatefulness (oh, yeah, suicide can be quite hateful but until you depicted an archetypal example I wasn't going there) and your claims my beliefs stem from some night in 2007 are just rude. I'm sorry if my mention of that night bothers you but you know what a self-aggrandizing P. T. Barnum of a bastard I am. I manipulate people like claymation figures, indifferent to their fates.
Oh, yeah, you're aware I've repeatedly violated the TOS because a technical constraint allows evil people like me to avoid detection until my prosaic babble (TM) gives me away, usually before my 3rd post. I remember your gratuitous reference when I mentioned the vocal homophobia of some Reggae musicians -- as if it was OK for me to sneak in until I displeased you. If you can't recall it I'll find it for you.
Huh? Honey, you been smoking Drano? "Right to die" is part of "right to live" -- in more enlightened countries assisted suicide, after thorough examination, is recognized as a basic human right, in somewhat the same way as hospice care.
Now if you need to get in your last manly, terse judgments go for it. For the sake of world peace you're on my ignore list at 5PM today.
Happy New Year!
In another thread a tangential discussion about suicide being a selfish act surfaced.At first I was going to come into this thread and discuss this issue (since it was my comment that stirred the pot over there); but it seems you don't really want a discussion.
I can't imagine what that must be like.Wow. :o And you moved this "discussion" out of that thread out of kindness to help that member and for respect to his feelings; but you'll come over here and rag on a different member and rip at his feelings. Dude, either be helpful or don't. ::) You're sounding kinda bi-polary to me. LOL
Maybe if I'd known I might have changed a few words but my rambling off topic points remain the same, albeit with a better understanding of how your views were formed.I wish you would have changed some words so we could have discussed the topic since a lot of what you have written really doesn't make much sense. Also, a lot of what you have written is so hateful that you're surely not the one to objectively discuss this topic.
This should probably be in "Mental Health" but I'm posting here and ask the mods to delete or lock the thread instead of moving it. I hope you understand my reasons. Also, the issue is relevant to more people than just us deranged maniacs haunting that forumMy vote is to LOCK the thread.
Quote from: Boo Radley on Yesterday at 08:50:08 am
I can't imagine what that must be like.
Wow. Shocked And you moved this "discussion" out of that thread out of kindness to help that member and for respect to his feelings; but you'll come over here and rag on a different member and rip at his feelings. Dude, either be helpful or don't. Roll Eyes You're sounding kinda bi-polary to me. LOL
...to be honest, this thread has little to do with any theoretical discussion of suicide...
What I see, instead, during this season of hope and peace, are attacks on other members and rambling thoughts, which have produced an acid environment and so no further discussion can be possible. Given this truth, I ask that this thread be locked.
My statement was not meant to "rag" on skeebo -- I cannot imagine what losing a parent to suicide, especially as a child, would be like. I'm sorry if it was generally misinterpreted. I doubt skeebo would deny his father's suicide played an important role in formation of his beliefs on the subject. My statements reacting to his depiction of blowing his brains out so his family would all have the pleasure of seeing the result were tacit agreement he could be selfish or, as originally stated, his desire to end his life prevented him from even thinking about such matters. (FYI, my diagnosis is dysthymia, not bi-polar disorder)
I've seen many suicide results and the toll it takes on others and yes I see it as a selfish and inconsiderate act. "Medicial assisted suicide is a whole different story."
It's selfishness to commit suicide where kids or anyone else will find your body. Think of the physiological trauma that you would inflict on others.
(aside from the fact that you're repeating yourself)Well like you've had experience. Suicide is selfish and inconsiderate of others. You don't believe it has an effect on Policemen, Firefighters and EMT's. Just go ask them if it doesn't effect them.
So if I drive to a public park and call 911 and inform them that I'm blowing my brains out with a gun and tell them exactly where to find the car then it's OK? I'm sure the police have seen worse and won't be traumatized. And yeah, by the way a guy in my local support group did exactly that scenario a couple of years ago.
There are plenty of scenarios I could invent to get around your faux concern with this issue. It's no more traumatizing than a married man who sucks cock, gets AIDS, then has to tell their kids as he's perched on a hospital bed with 1 t-cell and PCP now is it? That's life.
But beyond all that, your typical simplistic thinking paradigm doesn't seem to be able comprehend that someone that is suicidal and has severe mental health issues isn't going to think of how what they do in terms of suicide is going to effect everyone else, so your repetitive statements are ultimately nothing more than tedious BS.
But beyond all that, your typical simplistic thinking paradigm doesn't seem to be able comprehend that someone that is suicidal and has severe mental health issues isn't going to think of how what they do in terms of suicide is going to effect everyone else, so your repetitive statements are ultimately nothing more than tedious BS.
Someone wants to blow their brains out because they're use to paying the mortgage without their partners help is selfish... killing yourself because you can't buy your partner that fancy new ipod for Christmas is pure bullshit. Suffering from situational depression hardly constitutes killing one self IMO.
Well like you've had experience. Suicide is selfish and inconsiderate of others. You don't believe it has an effect on Policemen, Firefighters and EMT's. Just go ask them if it doesn't effect them.
That's their job -- like being in the military. If they can't handle such situations they should collect garbage for a living.Really, like you've been a police officer, fighter or an EMT or ever were in the military.
Really, like you've been a police officer, fighter or an EMT or ever were in the military.
If you'd done that in the other thread you'd have seen that the thread's author has more serious issues than what you just tried to state.If one reads that other thread, they see that the poster believed that killing himself would in some way "help" his partner. Though that poster also claimed health issues, nearly everything he spoke of as a reason for suicide was financial. It wasn't about him being too sick, it was about his life being out of control and him being out of money. Because he couldn't pay his bills, he had some screwy notion that his partner would be better off with him dead. As I have several dead partners, I felt obligated to explain that a dead partner doesn't help in the least and that it only makes things worse - at lot f-ing worse. Though I didn't even incur my partner's medical bills and debt when he passed away, I could not afford our lifestyle all on my own, and I had to abandon our home after our car was repossessed. Committing suicide, dying, is not going to help his partner at all; but will bring more debt, trouble, grief, and depression - the exact opposite of what he wants.
your typical simplistic thinking paradigm doesn't seem to be able comprehend that someone that is suicidal and has severe mental health issues isn't going to think of how what they do in terms of suicide is going to effect everyone elseI've been thinking about this issue since this topic started, and I think you've hit the nail on the head. There are two contradictory views being expressed about this subject - one is rational and one is irrational.
If one reads that other thread, they see that the poster believed that killing himself would in some way "help" his partner.
Gentlemen,
Please don't digress into unwarranted banter.
This is a very serious subject that deserves sober thought.
It is known that first responders are frequently traumatized by the scenes upon which they must administer, lets not belittle that.
.......but the fact remains, that when a person is submerged in abject misery, they are simply not capable of thinking of the impact on others, in most cases.
Let's get back to the discussion at hand.
I find this to be a very personal subject, because I have always told myself that if I came to the realization that I was slipping between worlds, I would rather take control of my own destiny, than to suffer at the mis-givings of those who think they are trying to act in my interest.
When it is time..........let me go.
Let's get back to the discussion at hand.I don't think this thread is about "assisted suicide"/euthansia.
When it is time..........let me go.
Did you, or did you not, go read all of his old posts? I've posted in most of his other threads and trust me that this depressive situation is not specific to the one situation described in that thread.yes, i posted replies in his other threads too.
this really is a messed up thread I think. Sometimes it's about that other thread and that member, sometimes it's about other people's issues, sometimes it's about terminal illness/end-of-life decisions, sometimes it's about depression and the mental state of people who consider suicide. It's too hard to argue in the abstract and too rude to discuss this in the specfic. ::)
Your point is well taken.Having had the onerous burden of making the decision to put seven of my cockers to "sleep" (though I wish with all my might, none have seem fit to go peacefully in their natural sleep; and I reckon that I'll have this burden to make yet again someday with the 3 spaniels I still have with me), and having used, under hospice guidance, pain meds to ease two partners out of this life, I would never argue against human or animal euthanasia, if and when the situation warrants. Easing pain and bringing about an impending death sooner is never a selfish act - the selfishness there is trying to hold on too long.
I agree.
Why do I think of Death
As a friend?...
--- Stevie Smith
Dear Boo, I hope you are personally well. There is something to cherish in each of your posts -- sometimes consequential; sometimes riffingly not (this season of hope and peace and rampant commercialism ). And it matters not which of your multiple forums personalities('?) has posted it.
A