Will let you know

[Frankfurt]

Hey guys,

Just needed someone to tell about my own personal moment of madness. To cut a long story short, I am a 28 year-old male who had never slept with another guy until 4 August. It's the usual scenario, had a few too many drinks and sent some text messages to a chatroom and met a guy I didn't know for a "good time". Had to leave my flat and walk though the pouring rain for 10 minutes to get to his (why didn't I just turn round and go home?). Anyway, when I arrived I told him I wanted to do anal safely, but unprotected oral was OK. He seemed OK with it. So we both did unprotected oral (no ejaculation, no piercings, not particularly rough) and then he tried to enter me from behind (with condom), but I was too nervous and it didn't work. So far, fairly safe, although the receptive oral carries a slight risk, but my oral health is pretty good. Had been drinking though, which I've read can make the mouth cells more vulnerable and, of course, I don't know his viral load. I then found myself laying under him and he tried to get me to rim him, but that's not my thing. My main concern is that he then sat on my penis and rubbed himself against it for about ten seconds. There was absolutely no penetration as I wasn't particularly erect. The problem is that I've read that anal secretions contain high levels of HIV. The other problem is that I'm uncircumcised and neglected to wash after the act which means I could well have had HIV on my foreskin which then got trapped under it when I "unretracted" it (is there a proper term for that?). I swear this was my first time with a guy, so there is the slight guilt thing going on, but to meet a stranger for this kind of thing was probably the stupidest thing I have ever done. I'd feel OK if I hadn't had every ARS symptom going at pretty much the right time, although symptoms started after 8 days, which is pretty early, but not unheard of.

I took a six week ELISA last Friday and am collecting my results tomorrow. I have never been so scared and haven't slept since the incident (well, you know what I mean). Tested for chlamydia and gonorrhea at two weeks and they were both clear. Haven't had any herpes lesions either, but I have got unusual purplish patches on my penis which weren't there before. I think on good days that there's only, say, a 10% chance of him being infected, with a 1 in 2000 chance of catching HIV from non-penetrative anal contact, although that might be less since there was no penetration whatsoever. On bad days, which tend to come more often, I'm absolutely convinced I'm infected. And all for what? A 10 second rub. The worst thing is it being my first time and being able to precisely identify the point of being infected (presuming the oral wasn't a risk). I probably sound fairly calm, but I'm not. In 15 hours I'll know pretty definitively either way.

What do you guys think? Am I completely overreacting or not? I keep thinking what will I be doing tomorrow afternoon. Will I be the most relieved person in the world or will I be at the HIV clinic being prodded and poked?

Thanks for your help.

Frankfurt

p.s. Might not be able to post again straight away - am going out to try and keep my mind busy. But will definitely check back within the next few hours.

[Ann]

Frank,

You can relax. Nothing you did was a risk for hiv infection and your test will return negative.

The only thing that was even remotely risky was giving oral, but studies of serodiscordant couples have proven to us that any oral activity is of little risk. How do we know? because not one of the negative partners became positive. They all used condoms for intercourse but not for oral. This study is discussed in the Transmission Lesson - you will find a link to it in the Welcome Thread.

The rubbing thing is called frottage and frottage is not a risk for hiv infection. Hiv is a fragile, difficult to transmit virus that does not remain able to be transmitted outside the human body. This is why the risk is found in anal or vaginal intercourse, where the virus is transmitted INSIDE the body.

Like I said, relax about your test. I'm fully expecting a negative result.

While you're here, please also have a look at the condom and lube links in my signature line so you can use condoms with confidence. They really do prevent hiv transmission.

Ann

[Frankfurt]

Hi Ann, thanks for your reassuring comments.

Coming back to the frottage, surely frottage anywhere else on the body is very safe (except perhaps glans to glans contact), but anything near the anus must pose some kind of theoretical risk. I would've thought that any virus that lives inside the rectum can also survive on the outside of the anus, given that it's warm and can keep the virus alive. Wouldn't "anal frottage" (I've learnt something new there) be almost as risky as insertive anal sex given that you are likely to come into contact with the same or similar levels of virus, if it were present?

I'm not trying to say that it's high-risk, just that surely the risk must be there. I keep replaying the scene in my head and asking myself why I didn't wash straight afterwards.

Anyway, I hope you're right. It's what most of my friends have said, but I read of a study recently saying that anal secretions can have even higher levels of HIV than blood and semen. That's pretty scary. Especially for an uncircumcised guy.

Thanks again.

[Ann]

Wouldn't "anal frottage" (I've learnt something new there) be almost as risky as insertive anal sex given that you are likely to come into contact with the same or similar levels of virus, if it were present?

Frank,

No. Frottage is not a risk, period. As I said, hiv is a very fragile virus and it does not remain viable outside the human body. It relies on little plugs on its outer membrane to infect a new cell - and that cell has to have the correct receptors for the plugs - and both these plugs and the membrane itself are very susceptible to minute environmental changes, including pH levels, temperature and moisture levels.

Frottage is NOT a risk for hiv infection.

The only caution I would give you over frottage where hiv is concerned is you need to have considerable amounts of self-restraint to ensure that it doesn't progress to actual penetration without a condom. Rub all you like, but NO unprotected penetration. Got that?

As you seem to be at the beginning of a more active sex life, let me give you a few pointers to keep in mind.

You need to be using condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, every time, no exceptions until such time as you are in a securely monogamous relationship where you have both tested for ALL STIs together. To agree to have unprotected intercourse is to consent to the possibility of being infected with a sexually transmitted infection.

Have a look through the condom and lube links in my signature line so you can use condoms with confidence.

Anyone who is sexually active should be having a full sexual health care check-up, including but not limited to hiv testing, at least once a year and more often if unprotected intercourse occurs.

If you aren't already having regular, routine check-ups, now is the time to start. As long as you make sure condoms are being used for intercourse, you can fully expect your routine hiv tests to return with negative results. Don't forget to always get checked for all the other sexually transmitted infections as well, because they are MUCH easier to transmit than hiv.

Use condoms for intercourse and you will avoid hiv infection. It really is that simple.

Ann

[Frankfurt]

Ann, I love you. My result was negative. And I don't have syphilis either, which is an added bonus.

I'll still get tested again at 12 weeks (European standard) as I know I'm not completely out of the woods, but I feel pretty confident after a 6 week negative result.

To anyone else out there who's had a low or fairly low risk encounter and still has (literally) ALL THE SYMPTOMS of ARS - IT MEANS NOTHING. Just get tested.

I've definitely learnt my lesson.

All the best from Germany.

[Ann]

Frank,

I've never seen a six week negative result change at the official twelve week confirmation. By all means get that confirmation, but you can expect another negative, especially since you didn't have a risk to begin with.

Remember to use condoms for intercourse and you will avoid hiv infection. It really is that simple.

Ann