POZ Community Forums
Off Topic Forums => Off Topic Forum => Topic started by: mecch on March 31, 2011, 07:37:00 pm
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Wednesday i was sitting in a Swiss clinic waiting for a volcanic mud bath and dying for a cigarette. I reached for the nearest magazine and it was a Paris fashion mag with an article about how the new lifestyle chic is "RETOX" - transgressive gourmandise. Eating rich, smoking, partying on week nights, driving fast, etc etc. Being a bad girl or bad boy, in other words.
Supposedly the slothy Brits are showing us how to live. Mentioned: new fat dandies, Zach Galifianakis, Pete Doherty, Yves Saint Laurent, Mad Men, the young Patti Smith, Jamie Oliver going barbecue, Gainsbourg. etc. etc.
Jouez la retox attitude !
La nouvelle inclination fashion, c'est la gourmandise
http://madame.lefigaro.fr/art-de-vivre/jouez-retox-attitude-030211-129016
Graines germées, algues, tisanes, jus de légumes..., le détox frise l'intox ! Marre des postures hygiénistes, vive la grande bouffe et le délire des papilles ! La nouvelle inclination fashion, c'est la gourmandise. Se faire plaisir, quoi de plus naturel en somme ?
Vous éprouvez comme un profond dégoût en ingurgitant votre eau chaude citronnée du matin ? Vous rêvez d’un bon vieux steak-frites façon bistrot ? Et vous avez carburé sans rougir au café-Coca-Bounty tout l’après-midi ? Pas de doute, vous êtes frappée d’une crise de « retox » aiguë! C’est grave, docteur ?
Non, plutôt réjouissant, au contraire. La retox, tendance émergente et doucement transgressive, est en effet le contraire de la célèbre détox. Et comme son nom l’indique, elle consiste à réintroduire avec volupté dans sa vie toutes sortes d’interdits délectables. Du saucisson aux fraises Tagada, en passant par le pain de mie bien blanc ou la grasse matinée au chaud. Au lieu du yoga à l’aube dans une pièce à dix-sept...
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I have had 45 years of Retox , I don't think I can stomach any more . If there is such a thing I think I may have partied myself sober .
Every now and then I still will over do it and end up with some manner of a hangover , then I'm done for many months .
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Yeah Retox is definitely a stupid fad. But I do like the idea of a counterbalance to the rich and idle detox nazis who carry it all way too far.
Anyhoo I thought it was funny cause i was waiting for my detoxifying mud bath only to discover how unchic I was. ;D
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I wish I had a Quarter Pounder w/cheese.
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You said it jg!
My 'mud wallowing drunks' are definitely a thing of the past. When I was younger, they were fun and I was never obnoxious even after way too much to drink. That whole experience is nothing I desire anymore. Call me two hit Lucy, but I would just not be able to nor would I want keep up with that crowd at this point.
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Speaking of Paris, today I saw a jacked up dualie with longhorns mounted to the hood and a bumper sticker that said "Texas is bigger than France". Finally someone who appreciates geography fun facts!
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Something tells me the owner is very chic and Retoxed!
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volcanic mud bath? this sounds fake and poser. i'll do a horsecrap bath instead. i bet its actually good fer yer skin.
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Too bad they don't have a soak that draws pretension out.
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Meech-
I see this posting to be the most flagrant display of ostentation and pretentiousness that you have achieved thus far. You seem to be quite happy to flaunt your advantages in life to a group of people of whom a fairly large percentage of are disadvantaged. A lot of the people here are on public assistance, relying on ever shrinking governement dollars to help them survive. The live in fear of each budget cut that comes down the pike, knowing that each new election cycle could spell the end of the funding they rely on for their meds, rent, and food. Do you EVER read posts from the people who have been kicked off disability? Can't afford meds, or doctors visits? Or is this just too depressing for you?
Has it ever occurred to you that, in light of the audience you have here that your endless bragging about living in a country with excellent health care for all, spa visits, fine wines, going to sex clubs in other countries (one wonders WHY you have to go to another country to get laid, but find it easy to imagine why) re-decorating your rather large house for each of the four seasons, making a lot of money, etc etc, that this just might be inconsiderate and in poor taste? You are the Marie-Antionette of the Forums in this respect. Have you ever once thought that posting of your excesses in life to a large group of people that have very little is inconsiderate at best? Time to come out of your solipsistic existence and acknowledge that there are experiences in this world other than yours. In another thread you asked about the saying of the older generations, here's one for you: "Practice what you preach" If you're so hip on quoting Marx, y'know "From each according to his abilities...." maybe it's time for you to embody it.
And as for quoting an entire article in French, when you know damned well that most of us are unable to read it, that is just over-the-top pretensiousness no matter how you look at it.
Absolutley Fucking Disgusting.
CaptCarl
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Meech-
I see this posting to be the most flagrant display of ostentation and pretentiousness that you have achieved thus far. You seem to be quite happy to flaunt your advantages in life to a group of people of whom a fairly large percentage of are disadvantaged. A lot of the people here are on public assistance, relying on ever shrinking governement dollars to help them survive. The live in fear of each budget cut that comes down the pike, knowing that each new election cycle could spell the end of the funding they rely on for their meds, rent, and food. Do you EVER read posts from the people who have been kicked off disability? Can't afford meds, or doctors visits? Or is this just too depressing for you?
Has it ever occurred to you that, in light of the audience you have here that your endless bragging about living in a country with excellent health care for all, spa visits, fine wines, going to sex clubs in other countries (one wonders WHY you have to go to another country to get laid, but find it easy to imagine why) re-decorating your rather large house for each of the four seasons, making a lot of money, etc etc, that this just might be inconsiderate and in poor taste? You are the Marie-Antionette of the Forums in this respect. Have you ever once thought that posting of your excesses in life to a large group of people that have very little is inconsiderate at best? Time to come out of your solipsistic existence and acknowledge that there are experiences in this world other than yours. In another thread you asked about the saying of the older generations, here's one for you: "Practice what you preach" If you're so hip on quoting Marx, y'know "From each according to his abilities...." maybe it's time for you to embody it.
And as for quoting an entire article in French, when you know damned well that most of us are unable to read it, that is just over-the-top pretensiousness no matter how you look at it.
Absolutley Fucking Disgusting.
CaptCarl
Oui.
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Meech,
For someone who proposes to be as smart as you, it is unfortunate that you seem to lack people skills. The Capt said it well and I can't tell you how revolted I am reading about your high life style, when I am worried about having enough money to simply live. I do not begrudge you your standard of living, however I do resent your constantly reminding so many of us, of just how little we have.
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Oh my god, I've never read such BS in my life. CaptCarl & killfoile you should be embarrassed by your outbursts. Are you saying that no one is allowed to post in this forum unless they are as miserable as you? There’s a whole world out there. Just because someone is not the same as you does not mean they have to keep their mouth shut. Following your reasoning does this mean that no one can post unless they are in a third world country, with no access to any medical treatment at all and dying of AIDS?
I’m astounded by the venomous atmosphere within this forum sometimes.
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Oh my god, I've never read such BS in my life. CaptCarl & killfoile you should be embarrassed by your outbursts. Are you saying that no one is allowed to post in this forum unless they are as miserable as you? There’s a whole world out there. Just because someone is not the same as you does not mean they have to keep their mouth shut. Following your reasoning does this mean that no one can post unless they are in a third world country, with no access to any medical treatment at all and dying of AIDS?
I’m astounded by the venomous atmosphere within this forum sometimes.
Gimme a break, precious. No one's saying that people have to completely keep their mouths shut, but even a hint of discretion certainly would be appreciated.
I mean let's get real. At a certain point, it's kind of like going into a quadraplegic's room and telling him what a great day it is outside for a jog while showing him pictures from your hiking trip to Grand Canyon.
I totally understand where Joe and the Rev are coming from.
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Oh my god, I've never read such BS in my life. CaptCarl & killfoile you should be embarrassed by your outbursts. Are you saying that no one is allowed to post in this forum unless they are as miserable as you? There’s a whole world out there. Just because someone is not the same as you does not mean they have to keep their mouth shut. Following your reasoning does this mean that no one can post unless they are in a third world country, with no access to any medical treatment at all and dying of AIDS?
I’m astounded by the venomous atmosphere within this forum sometimes.
I never said any such thing about who should be able to post or why. I was commenting on how the OP loves to detail his lavish lifestyle, in a forum, that he knows is populated with many folks of little means. You may recognize the ideas by the names of compassion and empathy. However, the difference between you and me, is I expressed my sentiments respectfully, whereas you... not at all. Now, tell me again, why I should care what you think?
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I’m astounded by the venomous atmosphere within this forum sometimes.
I would argue that accusing people of saying something that they clearly didn't say is "venomous". But then again, hypocrisy of the highest degree has always been stock in trade at AIDSmeds.
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Oh my god, I've never read such BS in my life. CaptCarl & killfoile you should be embarrassed by your outbursts. Are you saying that no one is allowed to post in this forum unless they are as miserable as you? There’s a whole world out there. Just because someone is not the same as you does not mean they have to keep their mouth shut. Following your reasoning does this mean that no one can post unless they are in a third world country, with no access to any medical treatment at all and dying of AIDS?
I’m astounded by the venomous atmosphere within this forum sometimes.
The thing is... this thread could have been created without the need (altogether) of this particular preface:
Wednesday i was sitting in a Swiss clinic waiting for a volcanic mud bath and dying for a cigarette. I reached for the nearest magazine and it was a Paris fashion mag with an article about how the new lifestyle chic is "RETOX" - transgressive gourmandise.
It could have been stated as: "I recently ran across an article in a magazine..." and it would have been more inviting to some (and it wouldn't have sounded so snobbish), but c'est la fuckin' vie.
Other than that, as usual, meh!
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Oh my god, I've never read such BS in my life. CaptCarl & killfoile you should be embarrassed by your outbursts. Are you saying that no one is allowed to post in this forum unless they are as miserable as you? There’s a whole world out there. Just because someone is not the same as you does not mean they have to keep their mouth shut. Following your reasoning does this mean that no one can post unless they are in a third world country, with no access to any medical treatment at all and dying of AIDS?
I’m astounded by the venomous atmosphere within this forum sometimes.
You have accused a couple of members of saying something they didn't actually say, and that my friend is the only Paku!!! I have read here, apart from Mecch's totally meaningless post.
c'est la fuckin' vie.
That I do understand... ;D
Jan
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Hmm. I'm not sure if I should respond and reveal more -- but I YAM WHO I YAM.
There are members who own homes or apartments. Cars. I will never ever have that. There are members who have families, children. There are members with middle class jobs with good salaries. Higher than mine I am absolutely sure.
Listen, everyone “has” some "lovely" aspects of their lives.
The point of the post for those who don’t see the self denigration was my busting on my own pretension, cause I thought the volcanic thing was kind of froufrou for me, but also kinda of cool. But then the FRENCH told me ha, its passé. Its a lifestyle joke on myself. If you don't have just a little of that "Gweneth Paltrow Goop" pretentiousness inside yourself, 1) good for you and 2) you may not relate to how we who do, can catch ourselves up and then feel silly about it.
As for clinics -- its very central European – doctors routinely prescribe such clinic treatments. Germany, Austria, Switzerland. The communists had these, too!
The point of posting the French text is just that - French IS pretentious. It is ALSO beautiful, and sensual, and endlessly fascinating and irritating for quite a few people in all other cultures around the world. Many Americans love to love/hate everything about the French. Others just love to hate the pretentiousness. No affection is possible.
I am ordinary middle class. The kind that enjoys some mondainités.
Take it as another reference for what middle class life is in Europe. Me going to a sexclub in another country is like a guy from Alabama going to New Orleans for fun.
I was born your average lower middle class boy and got prestigious degrees through hustle, ambition and scholarships, baby. That's the American dream, man. I have also been homeless – really homeless – 3 times – pursuing dreams outside my employable skills and credentials. Dreams outside my class. I lived some years with no insurance, no security, and so on and so on. I buried a lover who lost everything when he got AIDS as he was living just as precariously as me. If you could have seen his beautiful squatted home in Brooklyn A palace. Shockingly sensual. And he was not rich. His story ended up in an American nightmare - cause there is no safety net and I've felt that and lived it so deeply in my bones, that anxiety, its one of the reasons I moved to Europe.
It's a big world out there and anyone can get HIV. I understand the range of wealth and poverty present in this forum. Some of you seem to have little imagination for the complexity of people's lives. Why make such rigid reductive definitions of other people? I've lived in flop houses and royal palaces. Have friends who are multimillionaires and junkies on public assistance. If I lost my job tomorrow, I'd be in the shit. Changing countries and occupations, I have no retirement.
There have been so many precarious times in my life that I've always – ALWAYS - valued finding sensual pleasures in the here and now, simply because they are so lovely. I'll ride my bike home, uphill, in a cold rain, rather than take a taxi. That's enough cash for a little foie gras and Sauterne another day. Extend that to a life you can understand how a childless middle class guy can enjoy some pleasures. Its all relative.
I really do change my décor 4 times a year and why is that pretentious? It’s a way of living. Lots of people do this, people who are interested in objects and their surroundings. Its not dependent on having wealth. (It is dependent on having storage space, however.)
For 20 years my friends have marveled at my generosity as a host. Eat well, drink well, (and the sacrifices come in other parts of life). I’ve had friends with double and quadruple my salary, doctors, bankers, drop their jaws when we’ve gotten closer and they realized I don’t have much money. It was assumed I did because there’s always champagne, and luxurious bed linens. Is that pretentious? Its reckless really, but that's who I am. That's my value. If someone is so *grounded" and unpretentious that they can't smile a bit at another person's flight of fancy or folie de grandeur, that's a pity. We ALL have our folies. Trust me on that.
Finally, I love media, and love silly lifestyle news, trends, and I think I try to take everything with a grain of salt. If you are not into media, politics, lifestyle, and irony, you probably find this irritating, but that doesn't make you right. Its just a judgement call.
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Hhmm. I don't see any accusations in my post, a question yes. And as is common around here the responses totally ignore the whole point of a post and just attack some little part of it. The fact is when you attack someone’s OP you are trying to control what they can and can’t post. You are in fact trying to stop them from posting things that don’t meet your approval. Would you be more comfortable if posts were initially PM’d to you for approval before they are posted? Maybe a guideline could be produced that lists acceptable topics?
There seems to be a few that don’t like the OP, I don’t really care who you like. But there is no need to attack and try control someone’s posting. If you don’t like the things a person says then it’s quite simple – don’t read their posts. The name of the OP is listed right next to the posts title so you can actually see who has written it. The choice is yours.
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Hhmm. I don't see any accusations in my post, a question yes.
And some histrionics and hyperbole, dear. Let's not forget those
Don't sell your efforts short.
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Oh my god, I've never read such BS in my life. CaptCarl & killfoile you should be embarrassed by your outbursts. Are you saying that no one is allowed to post in this forum unless they are as miserable as you? There’s a whole world out there. Just because someone is not the same as you does not mean they have to keep their mouth shut. Following your reasoning does this mean that no one can post unless they are in a third world country, with no access to any medical treatment at all and dying of AIDS?
I’m astounded by the venomous atmosphere within this forum sometimes.
LPrince-
Sorry to disappoint you kiddo, but this was not a spur of the moment outburst, but I actually did spend some time thinking about the message I wanted to get across with my posting. I wasn't sure of the exact wording until I actually wrote it, but the message itself I had in mind.
Another thing that may disappoint you is that I don't lead a miserable life. Quite the opposite actually. With the awareness that nothing is perfect, I'd have to say that I am extremely satisfied with life and the way it has turned out. Have very few complaints, no regrets, and a general feeling of contentment. I need nothing more... I know that there's a whole world out there, I've been there and experienced a lot of it. Seen a lot it has to offer too, the beautiful and the ugly. Contrary to your belief, I don't want to spend much time with people who think just like me, life gets pretty boring pretty quickly when one does this. Instead I try to spend time with a variety of folks with a variety of beliefs, as I find that doing this enriches my world and broadens my horizons....
I have not, nor would I tell anyone to "keep their mouths shut." So please refrain from insinuating that I have done so. As far as following my line of reasoning to the point of only allowing third world citizens to post here baffles me. It also illustrates that reasoning isn't one of your strong suits. So until you learn the power of reasoning and can figure out what someone is really saying, please, spare me your righteous indignation.
The point I made clearly was lost on you, go back and re-read and absorb the message, rather than getting hung up on the words, then maybe you can figure it out. Tim put it perfectly with the remark about blathering on about hiking Grand Canyon to a quadripalegic, which is what most of this post is the equivalent of. And if you look at the response the OP gave in his defense. He's not really well off, just another working class Joe. All his friends love the fact that he entertains them in a lavish style, y'know, nothin' but the best. And hey, since everyone else redecorates several times a year, why not?
I have no issues with people who live well and have money, I know and cherish the friendships of quite a few. What I don't love is when people of their rank prattle on about it on a regular basis to people who are barely getting by.
And yes, the atmosphere does indeed get venemous, your post keeps the tradition alive quite nicely.
CaptCarl
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And as is common around here the responses totally ignore the whole point of a post and just attack some little part of it. The fact is when you attack someone’s OP you are trying to control what they can and can’t post. You are in fact trying to stop them from posting things that don’t meet your approval. Would you be more comfortable if posts were initially PM’d to you for approval before they are posted? Maybe a guideline could be produced that lists acceptable topics?
And rather obliviously, you just indicted yourself...
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Yep, point totally missed again. I’ll break it down. Although the words may not have been said to the OP to not post or to keep his mouth shut, the actions very much did so. This my dear is bullying and is totally unacceptable.
Since we are talking past each other and not too each other it would probably be a good place to end. I think I’ll go take a mud bath.
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Yep, point totally missed again.
Well at least you admit that you're kinda dense... :-*
I’ll break it down. Although the words may not have been said to the OP to not post or to keep his mouth shut, the actions very much did so.
Break it down all you want, but it still doesn't mean what you want it to. I never said to keep his mouth shut, just to think before he opens it. Otherwise refer to my first comment above.
This my dear is bullying and is totally unacceptable.
No it isn't bullying, perhaps Santa will bring you a dictionary next christmas...
I think I’ll go take a mud bath.
Sure, go for it. Might be hard seeing as how you're still on this board trolling. Take Texas Studs advice, and bathe in shit instead. Far less pretensious you know ;)
CaptCarl
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Yep, point totally missed again. I’ll break it down. Although the words may not have been said to the OP to not post or to keep his mouth shut, the actions very much did so. This my dear is bullying and is totally unacceptable.
Oh please. Are you proposing that stating opinion in a post is now a form of bullying? Nobody told the OP to do anything, except maybe be a little more sensitive in his posting, so how is that bullying? What I find as bullying, is for someone to come into a thread, with their guns blazing, paint the OP as a victim and provide the righteous indignation of someone not involved in the actual thread. Do I have that right? As I said before, remind why I should care what you think?
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What the old saying? Freedom of expression doesn't mean freedom from response, dipshit.
The dreary "bullying" canard is only ever trotted out by the vapid few who contribute five-eighths of fuck all in terms of substance.
"Bullying" is just another term for "OMG you're right but I can't bring myself to admit it."
MtD
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Yep, point totally missed again. I’ll break it down. Although the words may not have been said to the OP to not post or to keep his mouth shut, the actions very much did so. This my dear is bullying and is totally unacceptable.
And this, mah dear, is total and utter bullshit.
Cheers, hugs, toodles, snoggings, bisous bisous, and kisses (just in case you feel that this is bullying as well; it comes with lots and lots of love and smiley faces) :) ;) :D ;D 8) :-*
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HOW DID I MISS THIS????
(http://i53.tinypic.com/28w13sg.jpg)
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Oh brother. The purpose of the preface was to point out that while Mecch was busy doing the "detox" routine he spied an article espousing the trendiness of the alternative "retox". This entire exchange borders on the ridiculous and reinforces the "gang up on mecch" mentality that is so pervasive here.
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Oh brother. The purpose of the preface was to point out that while Mecch was busy doing the "detox" routine he spied an article espousing the trendiness of the alternative "retox". This entire exchange borders on the ridiculous and reinforces the "gang up on mecch" mentality that is so pervasive here.
Who are you, the fucking narrator?
Remember, whilst they're beating up on Kvetchin' Gretchen they're leaving your chubby little behind alone.
MtD
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Who are you, the fucking narrator?
Remember, whilst they're beating up on Kvetchin' Gretchen they're leaving your chubby little behind alone.
MtD
Speaking of fat people, long time no see Matty. As for me being harassed by anyone I'm more disturbed by talking heads on my television than the morality police of these forums.
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Speaking of fat people, long time no see Matty. As for me being harassed by anyone I'm more disturbed by talking heads on my television than the morality police of these forums.
Rachel Maddow can be tiresome can't she? You should tune into that up and coming "economically conservative yet socially slimy" FOX TV we've been hearing so much about.
And, whilst I'm Reubenesque these days, I was whippet thin in high-school. :)
MtD
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Why even post something like this, when it says "look at me and what I can do!" Really, Mecch could have just posted what he read without mentioning he was getting a volcanic bath, or whatever it was. I totally agree it's insensitive. And then why post an article in French, when Mecch knows a lot of people won't be able to read it? It's like putting a Lexus in front of someone who has to walk everywhere, and saying "look at all the perks this car has; oh but sorry, you can't drive it now can you." It's one thing to mention a good experience one has, it's another to flaunt it. And Lprince, you really need to be more sensitive to the audience on these boards. Why do you think someone wants to read about this extravagent lifestyle? Even people who don't have to choose between food and rent, this can be a bit much. Surely there are friends one can share experiences like this with, instead of parading it in front of everyone.
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I don't feel harassed by a critical response to my post. That is because I can understand my gesture was misread, or the tone seems off. Alternatively, maybe it wasn't misread, and I agree anyone can have whatever reaction they want to my lifestyle posts, stuff in the "zeitgeist" - it's not everyone's cup of tea, is it?
Whats more important is that the flaming "offense" people either feel and/or express. It reminds me of the same negativity that "can happen" in this forum between those HIV+ who have sufferred terribly and those who have not. In that tension, there is a repeated feeling that everyone who hasn't sufferred - MUST 1) either tell his/her sob story to be taken seriously (if they have one, to "prove" to the community their visceral understanding of the nastiness of living with HIV), or at least the sob story must be "on file" - or lacking that, MUST at least be sure to pay homage and respect to LTS, bracketing any "HIV is manageable" theme. Otherwise its insensitivity.
Newbies who can't play the discourse game - adapt -- or. well, we never hear from them again.
Only way to talk about the mundane experience of living with HIV is to put the caveat that it is not necessarily mundane. For xyz people in xyz situation.
OK, fair enough game. I think its important, these respects paid, and caveats mentioned.
So here in this post, I'm relating a frivolity of lifestyle, its something about capitalism and something about trends, and it pivots on social class, and I am neither rich nor poor, yes, AND it is at least general enough that ANYONE who as ever bought an expensive cologne when the budget called for dimestore, can relate. Or has hopped on a trend only to find it's already gone. Or admired a beautiful diamond but then thought - well what is a diamond?
So I hear the complaint, oh how pretentious and insensitive so I obligingly drag out my sob story about the personal hardships and successes I have endured "Living with Capitalism."
Whats silly is the personal nature of these criticisms - the newbie who has had an easy ride with HIV - turns into an identity that is derided, dismissed. The middle class person must really be this that and the other - a stinking bourgeois, as you will.
I'm not going to "poor down" my experiences in life, and I'm not going to "dumb down" my discourse - to anticipate that some people can't engage in discourse, when that is what is on offer. THAT would be even more pretentious - because condescending. And surely discourse play IS a option in Off Topic forums. Meandering conversations (or irrelevant of course) does not equal mean irreverency. Disrespect.
Last night I had drinks at a friends house in Geneva. His bf was born rich and hasn't worked much in life. My friend is up from the bootstraps and makes a lot of money now, but its always been up and down with him, in his case prison to villas to studio apartments to many houses, etc etc. (compared to my palaces to flop houses range). Hes a hard worker and also a hard partier. They are going this week to Palm Springs for 6 weeks. I would call them somewhat retired marginal jet setters. Not real die hards. Oh, and its quite possible my friend, who is HIV+, might die of a serious disease next year. Do you think I spent the evening begrudging them their life of ease and luxury? Did we talk about his illness?
In fact, we spent the evening speaking about interior design and movies and politics. ANYONE who reads and takes an interest in any one of these subjects can talk about them in a social way, without having to get all judgemental or feeling anxious about one or others personal stake.
They of course have vast knowledge on the high-end stereotype when we think of "interior design" - AD, House Beautiful, lifestyle of the rich and famous, etc - because of their money and interests. I have more info on movies. But in a conversation, you can take discussion to other levels - in REFERENCE to what you know. We discussed "makeover" design shows - you know - one weekend 2000 Euro transformations for average Joes. Who hasn't watched these and been alternately appalled and occassionally surprised by the staple gun and masking tape "design" -- and even better if its a gay designer. And we discussed AD and designing for the super rich. Nobody insulted anyone else.
And we discussed Rupaul's drag race and how the participants are finally such a rare and usual group of people. And then we discussed the relationship between drag and couture, how the drag balls and houses were inspired by couture and now the funny come around we see with a drag feeling floating around rich ladies and their clothes makeup and jewelery. Then we tried to differentiate the prostitute versus the drag look on ladies we see in the street - in budget clothes. And everyone knows you can go into a luxury boutique and come out looking like a cheap whore. And you can go into a thrift shop and come out looking like a princess. Etc etc etc.
I can talk about luxury interiors because its ALWAYS been interesting enough to me, since I was boy. Doesn't
mean I live in luxury, means I know how to think about "what is luxury" and "what is good design" and "what is a beautiful object" and these are different categories, and you need an argument about each and how they relate.
Walking to my friends house in Geneva, I passed the boutiques so I took 10 extra minutes, enjoying looking at the 10,000 dollar dresses in the windows at Prada, Valentino, Chanel. Because its interesting to me. The dresses are very pretty. Or not at all.
No one else is interested in "the red carpet", on a related matter? Its fun, fascinating. And the jewels and clothes have at least three values - "for the camera impact" - "luxury commodities - who, what, why, how do they circulate" and finally "aesthetic". If you are interested in jewels, and you aren't invited to the Red Cross Ball or don't know ladies with jewels, or drag queens with fabulous fakes - you can take a stroll through the jewelers in any jet set or major city and the beauty on display is astounding. (Isn't this another ravishing element of Elizabeth Taylor's mystique - my god she was beautiful and her lovers gave her the most fabulous jewels!)
So there are ALL sorts of things you can do, when you have a 10,000 dress in front of you. And your ability to pay for it is probably the LEAST intellectually engaging and promising departure point. You can enjoy that dress! If you like political economy, or marketing, or whatever, you can look at it and decide, where's the price demonstrated in the craftsmanship? Or, is it a ripoff. That's fun too, discovering a fraud. Or, did workers achieve something beautiful? How many workers. What's the ecological footprint and whats the exploitation backstory, if any. Etc etc etc.
Anyway, walking to my friend's house, I picked up some info because luxury products - its a standby topic with rich fags and for France and Switzerland, these are national industries.
What else. Well, my friend is too sick to ride horses right now, one of his passions. But he's not going to censor someone else talking about their physical exploits and hes not going to begrudge a friend's health and rigor. Similarly, people can talk about opposing politics without ending up calling each other fascists, or selfish and immoral, or deluded Utopian commies.
Have you ever seen John Stewart talk to someone you know he thinks is a political blackhole?
Didn't anyone listen to his rally treatise on the dangers of punditry, particularly mediated punditry, and a discourse of permanent outrage and contention?
I could be outraged about people's political and moral positions, and their aesthetic choices, but the ONLY way forward is communication and dialogue. I have always been like that. Explains why I could look forward to Britney Spear's CD as much as Bjork's. Apples and oranges. Prosecco isn't Champagne. Well liquor isn't top shelf and they BOTH have their charms and utilities.
Oh, and Mathew Barney is such a pretentious contemporary artist I feel like he's the reason Bjork has lost her fun - her music is too pretentious now.
Pity Britney is a medicated zombie at the moment. When she was good, she was delicious, like a perfect meal at a diner. Or Dairy Queen.
Britney Spears was like Diary Queen meets Car Wash - the movie. Effervescent Bjork is evolving into some dreary molecular cuisine restaurant you're supposed to appreciate but really can't warm up to.
Have you heard of "molecular gastronomy". It can be a total trip, but in its stereotypical worst, its like a meal made of tasty versions of hair grooming supplies - mousse, gel, spray, etc. Pretentious, much? If you are a foodie, you'll want a position. Frédy Girardet thinks its a scam. But his luxe versions of some French peasant dishes were 200 bucks a person.
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I find it odd how Miss P never gets this kind of reaction. Just an observation because I find Mecch and Miss P very similar when they talk about the nice things they have/had in life.
Leese *ducks to avoid the bottle of Romanee Conti Miss P just threw at her* ;D
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I know just what you mean Mecch . I had some friends over for dinner last week and we couldn't decide what flavor of Hamburger helper we were going to dine on .... so I made two boxes of the stuff and we were all happy . I made the cheesy beef & mac and the taco skillet .
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I guess the mud they used was nice and warm. Mike Rowe took one that was captured on YouTube:
(fast forward to 4:15)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6C-Z-SSjYIw&playnext=1&list=PL14C89DBE4F6DA659
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http://www.musicrooms.net/showbiz/15779-drew-barrymore%E2%80%99s-secret-love%3A-mac-%E2%80%99n%E2%80%99-cheese-in-bed.html
Drew Barrymore’s life isn’t all glitz and glamour, she says, revealing she is a fan of down-to-earth pleasures.
"I actually really love to lie in bed, watch TV, be a total sloth, and eat my favorite food: Kraft macaroni and cheese,” Barrymore admitted.
The 35-year-old says she is happy to swap couture for a night of cooking shows.
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Miss P generally keeps it much shorter and lighter and any shade thrown is obvious.
I'm often guilty of hammering a topic. mea maxima culpa
I started this thread pertly. But the fail invited the further explanation.
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There does seem to be a very fluid standard of what is, and isn't, an acceptable post here.
Interesting response (#34) Mecch.
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My panties certainly aren't in a wad over this, but a quick visit to www.translate.google.com (http://www.translate.google.com) tell us that the French translates as:
Sprouts, seaweed, herbal teas, vegetable juices ... the detox the frieze poisoning! Tired of postures hygienists, great food and great taste of the madness! The new fashion inclination is gluttony. Have fun, what more natural anyway?
You feel a deep disgust by chowing down on your hot water with lemon in the morning? Dreaming of a good old steak and chips way bistro? And you carburized without blushing at the coffee Coca-Bounty whole afternoon? No doubt, you are struck with a crisis of "Retox" Acute! Is it serious, doctor?
No, instead rejoicing at the contrary. The Retox, and gently transgressive trend emerging is in fact the opposite of the famous detox. And as its name implies, it is to reintroduce his life with pleasure in all kinds of delectable prohibited. Strawberry Tagada sausage, through the good white bread, or sleep in warm. Instead of yoga at dawn in a room at seventeen ...
for those who wondered. My French is rusty these days, so I tend to rely on Google Translate for such tasks. Although it doesn't translate perfectly, I think there's enough there to figure out the general meaning.
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I find it odd how Miss P never gets this kind of reaction. Just an observation because I find Mecch and Miss P very similar when they talk about the nice things they have/had in life.
Leese *ducks to avoid the bottle of Romanee Conti Miss P just threw at her* ;D
Oh please honey, everyone here knows Miss P is on social security. Anything I talk about is generally a reference to something I bought ten years ago.
btw, you seem to have Miss P-on-the-brain lately.
Also, I'd never do that Frenchie-poo part! How dare you. :(
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Lifestyles of the vain and vapid.
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Miss P generally keeps it much shorter and lighter and any shade thrown is obvious.
I'm often guilty of hammering a topic. mea maxima culpa
I started this thread pertly. But the fail invited the further explanation.
Come on girl, don't make excuses for being overly cerebral. I'm just better with a knife, that's all.
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Never get a mud bath at a German sex club. Smells like sauerkraut.
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Oh please honey, everyone here knows Miss P is on social security. Anything I talk about is generally a reference to something I bought ten years ago.
btw, you seem to have Miss P-on-the-brain lately.
Also, I'd never do that Frenchie-poo part! How dare you. :(
What can I say...you amuse me.
Edited to add..I last mentioned you a month ago but they do say that time flies for the elderly.. :-*
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they do say that time flies for the elderly.. :-*
It also flies when you're in a coma. Absolutely unbelievable how much so!!! ;)
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Never get a mud bath at a German sex club. Smells like sauerkraut.
Yum!
New idea just popped into my mind. Has anybody ever smelled marsh mud at low tide? That distinctive crustacean fecal and decay smell? Its cheap (would dare say free) and plentiful here along the coast of SC. Wonder if I could sell that and make a nice profit? Of course package it in an irresistible way for upscale spa clientele. Shit, if Dead Sea salts can bring in a profit, this should too.
Hmmmmm..
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Selling crustacean fecal mud might end up being a cash cow James, you just never know ;D
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Selling crustacean fecal mud might end up being a cash cow James, you just never know ;D
I think I saw the dirty jobs guy Mike R. shoveling tidal mud for spas , I'm almost certain .
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Selling crustacean fecal mud might end up being a cash cow James, you just never know ;D
Yeah. The Upper Crust(aceans) will pay serious $$ for that shit :D
CaptCarl
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Yeah. The Upper Crust(aceans) will pay serious $$ for that shit :D
CaptCarl
Now THAT is some funny shit! Love it!